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Need Advice: Situation with Neighbors' Kid

  1. mrbee

    admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts

    @Mrs. Pen: Sounds like Chandler's downstairs neighbor who would bang on his ceiling with a broom when the Friends were making too much noise! Haha I am probably dating myself with my tv references!

  2. MrsSCB

    pomelo / 5257 posts

    @Mrs. Pen: omgggg it's the same people! They also bang on the ceiling when I exercise -- at 5 pm for no longer than 30 min. And I do it on carpet with no shoes on!! I stopped in the interest of keeping the peace, but frankly I don't feel it's unreasonable to exercise briefly in my own home... They also complained to management about us "walking around in the middle of the night." Yeah, sometimes I have to pee 😒

    @mrbee: I totally call our neighbor's Mr. Heckles! I have no idea what they actually look like because they've never actually tried to talk to us.

  3. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    Thanks for the responses, everyone! This is what I love about the HB community--so many reasonable, thoughtful women here.

    @pinkcupcake: @looch: @PinkElephant: @shortcake: @Trailmix: @hilsy85: knew there were some other brownstone dwellers out there and was hoping you'd weigh in thanks for sharing your thoughts and how you've dealt with your own situations. I'm going to go talk to them, and will be very polite and Golden Rule in my approach. Luckily every interaction I've had with these people has led us to believe they're sweet and not dickhead neighbors who don't care/refuse to change. I do hear the moms out there (@Mrs. Lion: @Mrs. Champagne: @Mae: @Cherrybee: @Alba4: ) who are saying their best efforts can't settle down toddlers, but I think that's where the padded rugs, restricting really loud toys, and maybe not repeatedly jumping off the couch onto the hardwood floor at 7:30am will come in. My husband and I are truly understanding people, and I don't expect the kid to tip-toe all day long, I just know it's possible to be much quieter because the last family was (and we noticed and appreciated it). It takes a lot for me to say this, but we pay a ton of money for this apartment and deserve to be able to enjoy being at home (I am asking for a few hours a week, here!) just like they do. I'm optimistic that they'll meet us part way.

    @PinkElephant, great point about blanket complaints getting disregarded for being to hard to fix--I'm going to get polite and specific. PS, play school?? are you kidding me, is that even legal? that sounds like this situation x10000 since you were trying to get your own kids to bed all the while.

    @Mrs. Pen: your response was great! wish you could come give a parenting seminar in my building

    @catlady: wow, you've had to move? ugh, I'm so sorry. hoping it doesn't come anywhere close to that. I do think these people will be the embarrassed type like you (or like I would be!) and not defensive and unpleasant, and hope they'll agree to rugs. I'm not looking for a cure-all, just less insanity.

    @MrsSCB: that is total crap. feeling thankful for these people after reading some of these stories!

  4. Cherrybee

    papaya / 10570 posts

    @LCTBQE: I really hope you get the result you need. Being subjected to noise really gets you down. Let us know how your talk with them goes.

  5. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @sarac: @catomd00: @Truth Bombs: @MoonMoon: I think we can all agree that the "boys will be boys" phrase and the sentiment behind it can go to hell and die

  6. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @Cherrybee: I will, thanks!

    @GingerBebe: great suggestion about the foam mats! then I'm not just going up there saying, "hey why don't you spend $2500 carpeting your apartment". and I appreciate how you got specific about how your son plays--knowledge is power.

  7. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @2littlepumpkins: thanks for this. the reason I'm reeling at the idea of the master bedroom above ours as "playroom" is that it would ALSO be his bedroom, and if they do have another child, that baby's bedroom, too. Hope one day I'll be on the other side of the coin with a screaming baby of my own to feel bad about

  8. MrsSCB

    pomelo / 5257 posts

    @LCTBQE: yeah, it can be annoying, but we moved to the apartment from another in the same building because we had noisy neighbors (like pounding music at 3am types) and I much prefer this. So I really feel for you, it is not fun to be subject to noise all the time! I hope they're receptive and things work out well for you!

  9. travellingbee

    hostess / papaya / 10219 posts

    @MoonMoon: I think there is a big a difference between saying that "Boys will be boys" and acknowledging that boys and girls typically have biologically driven differences, one of which is on average a generally higher need to release energy for boys. I have taught elementary school for 15 years and there have been many studies done on this. That doesn't mean you can't hold boys accountable for inappropriate behavior, but a running and jumping toddler isn't inappropriate! That said, there are certainly high energy kids of either gender and I personally don't feel there is much you could do to stop a high energy toddler (not even 2!) from normal activities like running. Throwing heavy objects etc, sure.

    I'm not trying to be argumentative. I just felt that posters sentiments about rambuxious boys was misrepresented as Boys Will Be Boys, which is, in my estimation, excuse making for bad behavior. Naturally high energy is not bad behavior.

  10. maddyz

    persimmon / 1270 posts

    Lots had been said here and I just wanted to put in a vote for taking to them instead of a note. I've been dealing with a neighbor and notes and it sucks. I wish they would just talk to me.

    I babysat for a long time and it took weeks for us to figure out what new toys the girls got bugged the people down stairs. Once we put away the loud ones (anything with wheels and the large wooden blocks) it helped a lot.

  11. MoonMoon

    pomegranate / 3392 posts

    @travellingbee: I'm willing to believe that there might be some biological differences (though a lot is probably the result of social conditioning), what I was responding to is posts that literally said boys will be boys and boys are loud and there's nothing that can be done.

    I'm optimistic that @LCTBQE: and her neighbors will reach a satisfying compromise that works for both sides!

  12. Canoli

    persimmon / 1458 posts

    @travellingbee: thank you for so eloquently explaining what I was thinking.

    @lctbque: I came back on here after reading my response again. I realized that it came across snarky and it appears that I have a shrug my shoulders kind of attitude and that is absolutely not who I am. I have learned my lesson not to read and respond quickly as I'm trying to get my kiddos out the door for a play date as one was going in one direction and the other the opposite. Although you may not be interested in hearing my response because it is very clear that people have completely judged me (or at least that is how I'm feeling) and my parenting based on their comments. I did not realize that it was quite so offensive to people and I didn't mean it in that way. Perhaps my response came from a mama of a 4 year and a 20 month old that do the same things as the child you described and I was thinking ah someone I can relate to. Perhaps my response is from a mama with boys who get a glimmer in their eye when the louder something is, the more dangerous something is and the more riskier something is they go for it and quite frankly it.is.exhausting. So I agree with other posters that it drives me crazy and I absolutely teach my children manners and respect but sometimes it's tough being a parent and trying to figure out how to guide them appropriately. I'm just a mama trying to figure it out just like everyone else on here. I am saddened at times by all the judgement on here.

    My perspective is coming from being a boy mom. I certainly do not think because I have boys that should excuse bad behavior. I am aware that behaviors can be the same for boys and girls. In my personal experience my boys do everything at 1000% and my boys primarily have boys in their classes and I see similar behavior in them too. I have nieces and I do see differences in their responses and that is where I was coming from. That doesn't mean I think in every instance boys act a certain way and girls act a certain way.

    To give feedback to your question I absolutely think rugs is reasonable and I also think talking to them about it in a respectful way is appropriate too. Hopefully you can work it out and I do hope someday real soon you will have a screaming baby too🙂

  13. Mrs. Pen

    blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts

    @mrbee: hahahah yes! I just recently watched that episode, so funny, and so true 😂

    @MrsSCB: oh thank you for saying that because I didn't want to come across sounding entitled for wanting to exercise in my apartment. I get that I pay to live here as my home, but so do others. We're in a new place now, and it's been a month and the noise isn't nearly as bad - I have yet to hear my neighbors so I bet I could exercise here without any issues! (Although we're on the top floor now, which makes a difference).
    @LCTBQE: hahahah aww sure lol not sure how qualified I am though

  14. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @Canoli: didn't mean to put you in the electric chair! I think @travellingbee: explained this perfectly--like everyone, just ardently dislike that phrase when it's used to excuse bad behavior, and that's the context in which I always seem to hear it. I remember after I read your first comment, while I was out walking on the street, thinking that it probably came from countless hours/years of effort in parenting (which I obviously can't relate to and can barely even try to appreciate). You sound like the thoughtful and careful kind of mother I hope to become--didn't mean to be judgey and alienating.

  15. ElbieKay

    pomegranate / 3231 posts

    Chiming in late to say that I have studied and/or worked in predominantly male environments since college, and I find that "boys will be boys" is a sentiment used to excuse a lot of bad behavior in men. It's not limited to small children being antsy. I think there are better ways to phrase the latter sentiment.

    And that sucks about your apartment situation. I am so glad that we held out for a top floor apartment!

  16. 2littlepumpkins

    grapefruit / 4455 posts

    @LCTBQE: that sucks. All involved sound reasonable so hopefully it will all end up pretty drama free! Good luck with ttc! Wishing you a non-fussy baby very soon, lol.

  17. Boogs

    hostess / papaya / 10540 posts

    I'm fascinated by this thread. I have the loudest 15 month old and we are fortunate that we live in a traditional home without neighbors above or below. If we did, I don't think I honestly could do anything avout how loud he is. We have rugs and foam mats and it's still constantly so loud around here. He cognitively cannot understand that we need him to be quieter, so if a neighbor asked us do make that happen I would feel bad, but truly wouldn't know what to do other than say that we will do our best to work on the noise with him as he gets older and understands more.

    Out of curiousity, do they keep weird hours? You mentioned all hours of the day...do you both work from home? Are they up incredibly early or stay up extremely late?

  18. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @Boogs: I think if there were people living in the crawl space under your floorboards and you took away the rugs and foam mats, it would be louder for them your thoughts on your baby's development is the big reason why I wanted everyone to weigh in: I don't have a good grip on what you can or can't control with a toddler's behavior, what he will understand, and what's considered reasonable -- I didn't want to go up there and ask something unrealistic of my neighbors. If they put down rugs, took away the toys that make it sound like a bowling alley in my home, and told me they'd do their best as he got older, it would mean a lot to us and I think it would markedly improve the noise problem. I got some fantastic suggestions from other NYC/apartment dwellers yesterday and I think it'll get better. They don't keep weird hours at all--they seem totally normal and nice.

    @ElbieKay: I've never lived on the top floor and have never had this problem before!

    @2littlepumpkins: thank you

  19. Boogs

    hostess / papaya / 10540 posts

    @LCTBQE: Ok, so if they don't keep weird hours at all, how much of your day is their noise actually affecting? If it's not much I just wonder if you saying something is really worth it, or if time will fix the problem as he gets older. And trust me when I say that a child that age can make anything sound like a bowling alley. You would have to take away all of their toys and they would still find things to make noise with.

    Also, I think downstairs people do get a lot of noise, but they don't realize that upstairs people hear a considerable amount of noise also. My sister's current apartment is a great example. Her kids are a bit older and are really good about not being too loud. Their room is also fully carpeted. But, from downstairs they all still sound like elephants. On the flip side, somehow the downstairs people also sound like elephants walking around, they can constantly hear their kids, and can even occasionally hear partial conversations.

  20. catomd00

    grapefruit / 4418 posts

    Maybe I have a unicorn toddler but my 22 month old is pretty quiet, I can't imagine it being a problem if we lived upstairs from someone. Maybe it's her personality or the fact we have always encouraged quiet voices and play inside but regardless is not impossible. We are in a row home and our neighbors say they've never heard her. Sure she runs and jumps inside on occasion, but if she wants to get wild and crazy, we go outside. I really don't think there's nothing that can be done and I really don't think you're unreasonable to want to not hear constant noise while you're home.

  21. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @Boogs: I keep the same hours as the kid! I go to bed early at 10--so on bad days, which is most days in the past 3+ months, the noise is pretty constant during all of my waking hours, which is frustrating when I'm working 50 hours a week and would like to be able to enjoy my home a little on the weekends without going nuts. Again, I'm realistic and am not looking for silent perfection, just something closer to the noise level I was used to with the last family with toddler, which I believe is both reasonable and attainable. Also had assumed (maybe incorrectly, based on comments from a couple of moms here?) that he would just get louder and louder as he gets bigger.

    @catomd00: aw, she sounds heavenly! wish we had our own house. I feel for the people upstairs, because here there is nowhere to go--nearest park is a long walk away, it's freezing outside from Nov until late April, and there's no yard, just streets

  22. pinkcupcake

    cantaloupe / 6751 posts

    @LCTBQE: I totally agree - even if the noise during normal waking hours, it must drive you batty to hear it constantly. You do have a right to enjoy your apartment and (reasonable) peace and quiet as well. My almost 4 year old is pretty quiet - although she likes to run, I constantly remind her to use her walking feet indoors (which they have stressed at preschool since she was 2.5). So maybe my view is skewed by having a quieter child who listens (she listened even when she was much younger), but I think you can definitely work on getting a child to play quieter. My two cents, FWIW.

  23. Mrs. Pen

    blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts

    @LCTBQE: I actually think, as long as his parents help him with this, he'll get quieter as he gets older. My son has, based on our instruction and constant reiteration of house rules. He can't jump/run/scream in the house. That's for outside. So if he starts getting that way, and the weather is appropriate, we suggest that he go outside to blow off steam.
    I don't want to think of how loud he would be today if we weren't so intentional on getting him to lower his noise level Ahhh!

  24. Nutella

    persimmon / 1045 posts

    @LCTBQE: argh!! This sounds pretty ghastly!! I think you have already received some golden advice here so far. It's interesting that she's aware of the noise...

    But for what it's worth, my LO is 23mo and possibly not the usual, but he is really quiet indoors. We live in a semi-detached terraced house near the city which means some of our walls attach to our neighbours but they can never hear him - even when things are bouncing off our hardwoods. I was specifically conscious of this as they are expecting their baby next year & I know that quiet house is invaluable! So if he does start throwing things we redirect or take him out for a walk, read a book. I guess my point is, I'm conscious of it - being in a high-density area and all - so I feel like it's reasonable to have a conversation about it.

    I would also way prefer if neighbours complained to us instead of going to the landlord first. This happened to us in an old apartment after we moved in where someone complained about our puppy making too much noise during the day...& the landlord came door knocking to warn us. Left us feeling really resentful of the way they did it (anonymously) so hopefully they can be decent and compromise halfway!

    Good luck! and let us know how it goes!

  25. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    UPDATE: still hadn't gone upstairs to talk with our neighbors, was planning to this week. tonight we had a little incident at the front door of our house tonight involving police and mysterious smears of blood (another story, lord...) and everyone who lives in our brownstone came down to freak out--after the drama was over we were chatting with our neighbors, who as I've said are super nice people. so I was talking with them and interacting with the big offender, who btw is a *freaking adorable* baby, and the mom spontaneously asked me if he'd been loud lately. My husband and I were like, welllllll, yes, yes he's been pretty loud. I asked them if they had rugs down and they said they did. the mom was really apologetic and told me they'd work on it, and I told her we understood that you can't just get a toddler to stop moving, and she assured me again that they'd make an effort. My husband is so sweet and empathetic that he starts down the path of "listen, we totally get it, don't worry" and I kind of cut him off and was like, yesthatwouldbesonice and we would really appreciate it. she also told me to come upstairs and just let them know if it was getting too crazy, said she'd try to get him out of the house more, and asked if there was any particular time that it bothered us. I told her that when it goes on all day on weekends it was kind of tough, but of course we're gone all day during the week. She was very sweet and I think we were really polite, too.

    so, I'm surprised they do have rugs and looks like that solution isn't happening, but it felt like a really good conversation, I think we'll both be making more of an effort (mine being patience/understanding!). I'm glad the communication is open between us. seems like it'll hopefully be win-win--since they are aware that it's bothering us and are willing to try, I think it'll help. I'm going to make them cookies and leave a card saying that we appreciate it.

    thank you all for your thoughts on this! I was so glad to hear from the apartment/brownstone parents, particularly. @Nutella: @Mrs. Pen: @pinkcupcake: @catomd00: @Boogs: @2littlepumpkins: @Canoli: @MoonMoon: @travellingbee: @MrsSCB: @Cherrybee: @mrbee: @PinkElephant: @Hilsy85: @Mrs. Lion: @TrailMix: @catlady: @looch:

  26. mrbee

    admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts

    @LCTBQE: Sounds like an awesome conversation, congrats!!

  27. simplyfelicity

    cantaloupe / 6634 posts

    @LCTBQE: I am so the type of person to be upset about something and then say "no, it's really ok..." when confronted. So good for you for sticking to it!
    Also, I am super intrigued by this whole bloodied door situation!

  28. pinkcupcake

    cantaloupe / 6751 posts

    @LCTBQE: that sounds like a great conversation! You both seem like extremely reasonable, good neighbors Hopefully this will lead to some positive changes!

  29. Mrs. Lion

    blogger / grapefruit / 4836 posts

    Sounds like the best possible outcome! If it was me, I would try to have my crazy man out of the house as much as possible on the weekends for the sake of your sanity ;). Sounds like they are very reasonable. I hope it gets better for you!!

  30. Nutella

    persimmon / 1045 posts

    @LCTBQE: well done! I agree with @simplyfelicity on sticking to your guns! My husband would totally be the same, trying to underplay it like we didn't really care 😂 Sounds like they will be good to deal with regardless of how the little one behaves.

  31. Mrs. Champagne

    coconut / 8483 posts

    Sounds good!

    Other then the blood on your door! 😳

  32. catomd00

    grapefruit / 4418 posts

    @LCTBQE: so glad it went well! Hopefully you'll get a little relief now!

  33. Mrs. Pen

    blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts

    @LCTBQE: yay!! So glad for that- they sound like amazing neighbors

    And omg what a freaky situation! Yikes.

  34. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    the door situation: fresh blood smeared all over the glass and on the stoop and front steps when I got home from work. the cops came and one of them said he "had an idea" it was a guy "from the neighborhood" but not to be worried. I prodded him and was like, "so are we supposed to think it's some local doofus with an open wound?" and the cop laughed but refused to say anything more. WTF? wish we had about 18 deadbolts.

    @simplyfelicity: @Nutella: it was hard not to back out! they are SO nice and the toddler is so damn cute. I made myself stick to the conversation even though it was uncomfortable.

    @Mrs. Lion: @mrbee: @pinkcupcake: @catomd00: @Mrs. Champagne: YES, I'm relieved

  35. Mrs. Pen

    blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts

    @LCTBQE: haha I would totally be the type to just underplay it considering their response so good for you for being honest. I'm sure they appreciate it too.

    And omg yikes! That's so crazy! Gah.

  36. Boogs

    hostess / papaya / 10540 posts

    @LCTBQE: Aww they do sound nice! And I'm glad it was such a good conversation and they are totally aware and proactive, can't ask for much more than that.

  37. erinbaderin

    pomelo / 5573 posts

    @LCTBQE: I think the fact that they asked shows that they're aware of it, which is also nice - it means they're thoughtful and recognize that you are affected. Fingers crossed that the situation gets even a bit better!

  38. raintreebee

    pear / 1531 posts

    @LCTBQE: can you see if they have thick rug pads (not the thin ones) in addition to rugs? Those would be cheaper to add and help a lot. I would even volunteer to go halvsies on them if they don't have them.

  39. LCTBQE

    nectarine / 2461 posts

    @raintreebee: thank you, this is GREAT suggestion, and one I'll ask specifically about if I need to go up there and talk with them further. I would definitely go in halvsies but haven't heard a peep since I talked with them. @erinbaderin: yes, for sure--I'm grateful they are nice and conscientious people. I have so many friends whose apartments smelled like ashtrays because their neighbors smoked and refused to stop, etc... this is not at all a bad situation.

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