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I'll support them traveling but I wouldn't have supported them going to North Korea. (ETA, and won't, barring some huge change.)

My sister went on a trip to NK and they were very, very, very, very careful and were briefed extensively before departure and during their time there. Going to NK is no ordinary vacation/study aboard trip.

I am very sad for him and his family.... I would've been devastated that I didn't even know my kid was in a coma for that long

I think my level of support would depend on the reason for going. Going to a dangerous or third world country as an "educational" or primarily fun tourist experience? Minimal to no support. Going to a dangerous or third world country for a humanitarian purpose like Doctors Without Borders, etc? I would support it but with reservations (and probably would lose a few years off of my life).
* I know not all third world countries are dangerous. It was more of a broad statement, obviously with room for exceptions.

First, I feel terrible for this family and I think it's is highly likely that Otto never stole the poster or whatever. I hate that he is being painted by some as having done something, even something very insignificant, wrong or stupid when there is zero reason to trust anything NK has said about the matter.

That being said, I would certainly not be ok with my kids traveling to NK and I actually think I agree with the Trump admin for once that Americans should be banned from traveling there, at the very least for tourism. The risk seems to be too great and if you are arrested then the consequences can extend beyond just your family and put others at risk.

I'm not sure how I'd feel about other dangerous or war torn places but I agree with others that it depends on the reason for the trip. however , I dont think I'd be against a place just because there had been any terrorism at all there. Terrible situation in many places right now but I'm reality it's still the safest time in human history.

@pinkcupcake: I agree.

@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: When you say that he did not sign up for that, what do you mean? Did he travel to North Korea voluntarily or was he kidnapped? I haven't heard all of the details but I imagine that getting tortured while in North Korea is something that someone who travels there should expect to happen. I cannot even imagine why anyone would want to go there without some extremely compelling reason.

@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: but we see this happen all the time. Kenneth Bae, for example. Ppl go to North Korea, are arrested for no reason, tortured, sentenced to incredible punishments. It's not breaking news. I feel bad for the guy, but you have to know, going to North Korea willingly - you're taking a huge risk and a gamble, and there's a real chance you could be accused of a crime and something horrible like this can happen to you. You are, in essence, signing up for it.

@agold: @pinkcupcake: I disagree with this line of thinking, especially with regards to a young college student. When you are that age, you probably have no clue what you're signing up for. He signed up with a tourist company. He probably had no idea how dangerous going into North Korea would be. I certainly didn't know at that age!

I don’t know what sort of rules I would put in place on LO future travels – but to me, traveling to North Korea is not at all in the same ballpark at all as traveling for experiences (or any other reason) in college. Considering traveling to North Korea just for pleasure or whatever is frankly insane. It’s no secret that things like this happen there on a too-regular basis. It’s just not worth the real, and really serious risks of traveling there IMO. I actually thought it was already illegal to travel from the US to NK - - which makes the recently renewed restrictions on personal tourist travel to Cuba even more laughable and obviously petty than they already were; but that’s another topic.

That all said, you’re more much more likely to be shot by another American in America than killed anywhere else, so I try to put things in perspective. But to me, NK is outside of what I’d consider normal.

@Modern Daisy: @Adira: it's an assumption of risk. You assume the risks involved with going into NK. I say this as a Korean-American - i mean, it's just a place you don't go. But if you do go, you go with the understanding that it's dangerous, crazy shit can happen, and you can die. if you choose to willingly go, then you assume the risks associated with it. I don't see how that's victim blaming. Victim blaming would be saying he deserved it. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that when you go to a crazy country like NK, you take a huge risk.

@yoursilverlining: I agree. Traveling to a place like NK, Syria, Yemen...these are all places outside of the bounds of normal travel regardless of the motivation. I would hope anyone going to a place like NK would inform themselves beforehand and be aware of the risks and dangers. Just reading the State Department travel advisory is pretty chilling. https://travel.state.gov/content/passports/en/alertswarnings/north-korea-travel-warning.html

@Adira: @pinkcupcake: @agold:

Ugggh I wrote a novel and HB logged me out

I wanted to share my perspective since my sister took a trip there after her junior year. She had been following NK since she was in high school; and in college she was a poli-sci major with a huge passion for social justice, humanitarian rights, etc and she had always followed NK closely. So the opportunity came up to apply into this program that takes students there, she took it. You couldn't just pay money to go; you had to apply and be accepted plus it cost a ton. My family felt like she wanted to go for the right reasons, and we felt like this program's been doing it for a long time and has built good rapport. Of course we were nervous; but this was her dream. I know she was briefed extensively on the do's and don'ts. In her own words, she felt her trip went very smoothly. Of course she followed all the rules, etc.

I 100% agree that if they want to make something happen, something will happen and there is certainly a HUGE risk in going. With that said, I also don't think that it's ALL bad; there is a side of NK that really wants foreigners to go there and get a "good impression". They really love showing off it seems. There are a ton of people that go in & out safely. Is this a destination for an ordinary folk? Absolutely not. And with the current political climate, I'm not sure if my sister would go again. So many factors!

It's just hard to really say because we'll never know what really happened. I would only hope that the touring group at least made sure everyone understood how serious a trip into NK is and I would hope that they also briefed all the participants extensively...

@Adira: This makes me feel like the touring group he went with wasn't all that responsible. I agree with you. My sister already went with the straightest head possible and the most maturing understanding possible, and if something happened to her, it would've been tragic. I think if things were really that bad then we should just ban traveling there period.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/21/otto-wambier-fate-north-korea-tour-company-pyongyang

I would definitely not be happy if my child wanted to travel to NK. Once they're legally adults, I don't know that I could physically stop it from happening...but I wouldn't help fund it at least.

Related to the Otto Warmbier story, I read this account from his roommate in NK. I'm pretty skeptical of the alleged poster stealing, and reading this made me even more skeptical. Such a sad situation all around.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/josh-rogin/wp/2017/06/15/otto-warmbiers-north-korea-roommate-speaks-out/?utm_term=.b479b0a26d59

@looch: I do not know, but my own assumption from what I have seen/read is that his end was imminent and I think they didnt want to deal with the hassle of him dying in NK.

@looch: My guess is that he wasn't "useful" to them anymore. As depressing as that sounds, they can't get much from a dying or dead prisoner and they may not have wanted to have him actually die on their hands. This way they could say, "He got sick and fell into a coma, we tried to help him for a year, but it didn't work, so here you go." I don't actually believe the botulism story line they gave, but this way they never had to admit, "Oops, we killed him/let him die."

@looch: Seriously, and which is so sad for the family, is that the truth will never be known

@Mrs D: I guess we can't know for sure, but I'd agree that NK sent him home to die, so they didn't have to deal with the fallout if he died there. There's also a part of me that thinks NK did it to screw with Trump - they've been testing the waters since he took office to see how far they can push him and I think this is probably another example of that.

@Adira: But time and time again, it's been shown that is what COULD happen in NK. How is it victim blaming to say that? I mean, you go bungee jumping, you know there's a risk the line could snap and you could die. It's a risk, right? Isn't that the definition of risk? Victim blaming would be saying he deserved it. No one is saying that.

@Adira: i think traveling to another country - especially one with a regime like NK - seems even more obviously risky than bungee jumping. I mean, at least bungee jumping companies are regulated by laws and regulations. But, it seems like you and i have completely differing opinions here and may need to agree to disagree.