https://boards.hellobee.com/ Pregnancy, Baby and Parenting blog, by Hellobee en Tue, 05 May 2026 11:16:31 +0000 https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2855171 Tue, 06 Nov 2018 10:27:19 +0000 Anagram 2855171@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: aww....I totally relate to your post. In my case, I always discuss with my husband because it would be basically impossible to get a large amount out of one of our accounts without him noticing—he checks every account obsessively several times a day and is the type to notice if he filled out 12.62 at a restaurant but they misread and charged 12.68. </p> <p>So yes, I discuss with my husband. Also in my case, it’s a sister and she has schizophrenia—While there has been drug use, that’s not the primary issue. But a lack of normal mental capacity now means she is often taken advantage of by “friends”, sometimes she ends up needing more financial help than my retired mom can provide. Also, my sister can’t hold a normal job (like, her mental illness is severe enough that she will be on disability forever) because the medications that keep her stable have a host of side effects like she sleeps 12-14 hours a day, her cognitive abilities are diminished in terms of learning new skills. The thing is, when her medications are off, she’s off, and she’s done some really destructive things to my mom and herself and to the general population (like hey, she’s been in and out of jail mlre then once). This is not a secret or something I’m ashamed to talk about because I’m actually really proud of my sister and my mom. Mental illness is no joke, it’s not a choice, and it takes perseverance from family members to overcome it. </p> <p>I’ve written about it here in the past. But my sister is only with us today because my mom never gave up on her. This is what I’m circling back to with your situation. I don’t know your brother, but I have siblings who would counsel my mom to cut off my sister, let her work it out for herself, “hit rock bottom”, etc, but I’ve seen how homeless people (and women especially! The horror of what they experience) are treated in our society, and I would never let my sister be in that situation personally. My mom has more than once gone to legit crack houses in the scariest neighborhoods of Atlanta to carry my sister out to the car (sometimes with a group of her retired church lady friends). </p> <p>But I agree with PPs that giving cash is not a good idea. If there’s something he genuinely needs and you and your husband decide you can afford it—then pay for it directly. Don’t consider it a loan, it has to be a gift that you know you’ll never get back. If he needs food, buy food only. </p> <p>Definitely discuss this with your husband open and honestly going forward. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2855106 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 23:51:10 +0000 Mrsbells 2855106@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: without giving too much information I can say that I can relate to having a loved one like this. The reality is he is manipulating you to do things you wouldn't nornally do like not be honest with your husband. It sounds like a pattern of behavior and each time you give him money its just continuing the cycle. I know you feel like you are helping him by giving him money but its actually hurting him in the long run. At some point you have to be firm and not give any money to him and instead help him in other ways such as giving practical advice. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854928 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 12:32:26 +0000 Mama Bird 2854928@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: next time he claims he owes money to your parents, why not pay them back directly? I'm not sure the debt exists and even if it does, that whatever you give him makes its way to your parents.</p> <p>And I'm sorry, that's a tough situation. Sometimes people's needs are just a bottomless pit. DH has tried to help his brother in the past - not quite as bad a situation, but no help seems to be enough because the brother is enabling his own grown-up kids and has massive expenses as a result. My family is pretty needy too - not financially, more life stuff like cooking and cleaning, and one family member seems to think I'm responsible for helping them have a social life.</p> <p>I'd definitely focus on help that can't be misused (like assistance in applying for unemployment, and navigating the medical system) rather than handing over cash. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854882 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 10:30:20 +0000 Anonymous1234 2854882@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@codeitall: I think DH is right too, but in practice it's much harder to do. In this case of giving money, I was really more concerned for my parents. Him not paying them back put them in a bind. I didn't give the money to them directly because I didn't want my mom feeling indebted to me... family dynamics are sometimes so unhealthy. </p> <p>@Amorini: Thank you for the book suggestion. </p> <p> @Ajsmommy: We have a similar financial set up, most of our money goes into a joint account, but we each get an 'allowance' each paycheck to spend how we wish. I took the money from my personal account and would never give my brother money out of our joint account. I have also really grown apart from my brother and don't talk to him hardly ever. He is manipulative and selfish and I find it really hard to interact with him regularly. </p> <p>@Iced Tea: There's no question to me that mental health plays a role in this. Whether that is depression, anxiety, ADHD, or some combination of all of the above I'm not sure. I have investigated low/no cost mental health options to refer him to in our area and they don't exist. Transportation is also an issue. I suspect that much of his substance abuse was self medicating. I discussed this with him briefly yesterday. I also suspect that his brain chemistry has been further damaged by years of substance abuse. We talked about how if he had a reliable job with benefits that he could see a therapist, he recognizes he has struggles. I tried to do what I could to help him have strategies to move past feeling paralyzed. We wrote out a specific list of tasks he needed to to, with exact wording of things he could say to the people he needed to talk to. Then we talked about stopping when things get overwhelming and writing out a list of actions he's taking to make this situation better, writing down what is good, believing that not all is bad and lost, having the list to actually SEE that he is accomplishing things. I realize that thinking positive is not a cure to real mental health problems, but in the absence of access to professional help, I am trying to help him develop strategies. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854881 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 10:29:30 +0000 snowjewelz 2854881@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>You are not a horrible person! You are being a good sister and trying to help him without enabling him and setting him back by letting him think that he can just keep getting handouts from you. If you want to help him, maybe get him a grocery store giftcard or physically buy him some stuff if you're close by? </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854859 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 09:45:34 +0000 Iced Tea 2854859@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>You are a good person, and you obviously want what's best for your brother. </p> <p>I just want to add something that I didn't see expressed above. I would consider the possibility of other core issues, like anxiety or depression. These are so often concomitant with substance abuse and can be disabling, even if he is living clean now. </p> <p>I truly believe no one starves out of laziness. If someone is failing to take care of themselves, I think it's good to look to the mind and ask some questions. Debilitating anxiety runs in my family (including me), and when it is really bad, you just can't function like a normal person. You can know the rational steps you need to take, and yet you just can't do it. It's like you're paralyzed when faced with taking steps forward. </p> <p>Now, with treatment, I've been able to be a lot more functional. It's possible that I might have avoiding getting help if the consequences were less dire (if someone paid everything for me, for instance). I have one relative who was supported by his mother for decades and worked solely as an occasional handyman. When his mother died, he was angry that she didn't leave the house to him so he could keep living rent free for life--I kid you not. He had come to expect that she supported him. As far as I know, he never sought mental health treatment. So, while supporting someone with anxiety or depression is generally good, it can definitely go too far, if it prevents them getting any meaningful mental health support to move forward. </p> <p>Do you think this might be part of his struggle? </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854853 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 08:59:35 +0000 Ajsmommy 2854853@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>I can completely relate to your post.. I hope my response isn't too rambling and makes sense. I too have a younger brother whom has an addiction problem and also works a low paying seasonal job so he comes upon harder times during the winter (in upstate NY!! no less) anyway.... my mom is a complete enabler to him to what extent I dont' even know but I do feel like she might even send him money monthly!!!</p> <p>A while back my brother reached out to me asking for help. He couldnt' get a hold of mom and he said his truck needed work to the tune of $1100... he basically asked me for it. Mind you this is my brother whom I loved more than anything whom I protected and shared everything with growing up... but he's never met my kids and he's met DH twice (our wedding and a funeral) unfortunately our lives have taken us apart and we dont' see each other anymore.... </p> <p>I didn't give him the money... however that is only bc I would have had to tell DH about it bc I would have had to take it from our joint savings. LUCKILY I don't have that much in my own personal/private account.. the way our finances are set up I get a small amount each paycheck to my own acct.. I spend it though :silly: so I don't have any "real savings" of just my own. I think if it had been $500 and if I'd had it in my own acct I would have probably sent it to him just as you did. I however would not feel like I'd have to tell DH bc that was out of my acct and I can do what I want with it. I dont' see that as being deceitful or anything.... I choose to help my brother.... however as I said above if it was out of our joint acct I do feel I'd have to tell him.... and he would have said no way.. he's way more practical and less emotional PLUS he doesn't know my brother at all so he's not invested at all..... </p> <p>Anyway, I hope that all made sense and I think you're a great sister and I hope your brother comes out of all this on top!! You are so not a shit person!!! </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854843 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 08:23:43 +0000 Adira 2854843@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: I can sooooooo totally relate, so I feel you.</p> <p>I have an older brother who dropped out of college and then had a crappy job for many years. He finally got fed up with it and quit and then didn't have a job for over TWO YEARS! I was totally stressing out for him, but it just seemed like he wasn't willing to put in the work to find something. He eventually came to me to ask for money and it was awful. I was really worried that by loaning him money, I would be enabling him (he doesn't have a substance problem at least), but he's my brother so...</p> <p>Like you, I gave him $500 (after talking to my husband about it first). But I made it clear this was a one time thing ONLY and he'd best find himself a job ASAP as there would be no more hand-outs from me! He was pretty gracious about it and luckily he DID find a job many months later. I don't know his situation now, but he's still working, so hopefully all is going well.</p> <p>All that to say, I think you're a good sister and there's nothing wrong with gifting him the $500 once. But I don't think you should give him any more money. And I think you need to tell your husband - keeping secrets is not good for a marriage. It's hard to watch our family struggle, but your brother needs to figure it out for himself. With the way the economy is now, he really doesn't have an excuse not to find work (I mean, depending on where you live). </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854827 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 02:24:33 +0000 MsMini 2854827@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>First, I think you REALLY need to be upfront to your DH about giving your brother money. I just think that he is going to be upset and you have to own that. Keeping secrets like that do no good to a marriage.</p> <p>As for your brother, I can’t imagine how hard it is to watch him struggle, but he needs to be responsible for himself. Many people with substance abuse issues can be extremely manipulative with the people around them to get what they want. His disease (addiction) means that he will do whatever he has to do. He will cry to get cash, he will lie. It’s the nature of the addictive beast. Giving him money is putying a bandaid on a bullet wound for the briefest of moments it covers it up but it isn’t fixing a thing. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854822 Mon, 05 Nov 2018 00:53:56 +0000 Amorini 2854822@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: Hey, I know this all too well. In my case, it was my little brother. I agree with your DH about the enabling, as brutally honest as that is to say. But we all live and learn and do the best we can. A tremendous thing that you could do for your brother is read a book called Love First and see where it leads you and your brother and family. <a href="https://books.google.com/books/about/Love_First.html?id=BwzXDQAAQBAJ&#038;printsec=frontcover&#038;source=kp_read_button" rel="nofollow">https://books.google.com/books/about/Love_First.html?id=BwzXDQAAQBAJ&#038;printsec=frontcover&#038;source=kp_read_button</a></p> <p>❤️❤️❤️ </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854815 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 23:58:42 +0000 codeitall 2854815@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>I think your DH is right, and I'm going to guess that after this interaction, you might see his reasoning a bit better. Now, I'm not saying this is how your DH feels, but I have a sister in law that struggles with money and my DH bailed her out a few times without checking with me. Small amounts, so no major fights, just a 'did you have to?' discussion.. But then he realized how many times she was getting bailed out by various family members for the same stuff and he realized that she wasn't learning anything. Now we invite her for dinner and give her leftovers or give her a chance to clean our house for some venmo. I was frustrated when he gave her money, but I would have been legit mad if he gave her more than $100 without talking to me.</p> <p>I appreciate that you want to help your brother and you seem to be giving him all the right resources. The hard question is how much you value both relationships. You and your DH need to find a solution for you. Once your brother knows what he can expect from you, he will always count on having it. Make it something he will only want if he really needs it. Store a case of ramen with his name on it or something. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854769 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 16:58:19 +0000 muffinsmuffins 2854769@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: ah ok, I can understand that. I still think I wouldn’t be able to keep the secret that you gave him money, but I would just tell your DH that you won’t be loaning anymore but are having a hard time not trying to help (which is understandable) I don’t think you should be hard on yourself for wanting to help and not just automatically turning your back on him. I think what you did was totally reasonable. All you can do is put the info out there to your brother and what he does with it is his business. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854767 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 16:09:41 +0000 Anonymous1234 2854767@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>In the end I gave home $20, which I figured would buy a loaf of bread, peanut butter, some eggs, Mac and cheese, cereal. </p> <p>@muffinsmuffins: DH has a brother that struggled with substance issues and it wasn’t until the family backed off and let him truly hit rock bottom and be homeless that he straightened his life out. DH believes that our family is enabling my brother and he will never grow up unless forced to face the consequences of his inaction... whether he’s still using or not. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854766 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 16:01:48 +0000 muffinsmuffins 2854766@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>I like the idea of buying a few canned food items to help rather than giving money. It sounds like you did an amazing job trying to help him! It’s hard to not feel bad but he’s an adult and there are resources he can use, that you detailed to him. He needs to step up. But I would also be questioning why you think your husband would get mad? He is your brother and he needed help. That’s what family does. I would keep him in the loop from here on out. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854764 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:54:52 +0000 yellowbird 2854764@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: i agree that loaning him more money isn’t really the answer, even though that’s what he wants. Would your husband begrudge you taking him to the grocery store and stocking his fridge for the week? </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854763 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:53:02 +0000 MamaBear87 2854763@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>I agree with Lazb you aren't really helping by bailing him out with money. He has to want to help himself too. If he sat with you and wanted to set up some steps to make sure he didn't need money again that would be one thing. </p> <p>I would invite him to have lunch or dinner or something. And perhaps send him home with a few shelf stable groceries. Having family that have substance abuse issues is so so hard. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854762 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:38:10 +0000 LAZB 2854762@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>@Anonymous1234: you sound like an amazing sister imo. I’m occasionally pulled in to loaning family money, and I really need to put my foot down. It sounds like you gave him money and tried giving him so much help, I don’t think you are a bad person for putting your foot down. It’s called tough love and I’m glad you can do it.<br /> That said, if you can check in on him and maybe offer for him to come over for lunch or dinner once or twice so you know he is eating something, that would be extra amazing. </p> https://boards.hellobee.com/topic/morality-check#post-2854761 Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:20:16 +0000 Anonymous1234 2854761@https://boards.hellobee.com/ <p>I’m a regular poster going anonymous because my DH knows my hellobee username and I’d like this not to be attached. </p> <p>My older brother has had substance abuse problems in the past (pills and alcohol). He tells me he is clean now, but he’s lied about it in the past and I can never really be sure. I don’t speak to him often and really only see him at my parents house. He has a seasonal type job that is busy in the summer and he files for unemployment through the winter months. For years I have talked to him about finding a steady job with predictable hours and benefits, but he’s never put the effort into finding anything. </p> <p>Two weeks ago he contacted me with a long list of woes... he did a side job and hasn’t gotten paid, he’s been sick and missing work (which was true, he was in urgent care with my Mom), he borrowed money from our parents and needed to pay them back or they would be short for their monthly bills. I ended up giving him $500 out of my personal account and haven’t told my husband. DH would be very upset to know I gave my brother money and it’s weighing very heavy on me to lie by omission. </p> <p>My brother called again this weekend and asked me to meet him and help him sign up for unemployment and help him develop a plan. I met with him and tried to get his account set up, discussed how he could best talk to the guy who owes him money from the side job, suggested local businesses where he could apply for a steady job, offered to help with a resume and practice interviews, mapped out that the library is only one mile from his apartment so he can use the internet and computers there... but in the end he asked me for more money. His boss kept part of his check because he owed her money (I don’t know the back story), he has no money for food, he needs to pay more back to my parents, he cried. I felt totally duped and disappointed and lied and said I had no more to give. In reality, I could have given him what he wanted without much skin off my back.</p> <p>I’m so disappointed and frustrated that he hasn’t made any effort to permanently better his situation. It’s not that he can’t find a real job because of his background, he has never tried. Giving him “loans” is just not a solution in my mind because it does nothing to fix the long term problem and he only freaks out and wants to change when he’s neck deep and needing money. </p> <p>But realistically, I walked away from him telling me he could not eat for the week and knowing that I could have fixed that for him at the expense of either a major fight or lying further to my DH... and I feel like a shit person... am I? </p>