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That's a frustrating phase. DS went through it recently - constantly chewing me out for yelling at him, but not responding to anything less than yelling. At one point I asked him what on earth he'd like me to do as an alternative, and it gave him something to think about because... yeah... he wanted me to ask him nicely, but he totally knew that when I ask nicely, exactly nothing happens.

It's better now. I guess he's slowly growing out of it. Still needs multiple reminders, but usually not to the point where I have to yell. And every now and then he shocks me by going off and doing everything before I even ask. And then I always make sure to tell him how awesome that was.

@irene: I actually only have a few things that follow the "a before b" rule....and I give DS plenty of time to follow through. I would pick one or two things that matter to you the most and stick to your guns....then, once he is doing well, it becomes an expectation and you can add to his responsibilities. DS only went to bed aat 630 the one time when he told me he was too tired for chores, lol. But he definitely listened about laying in bed quietly because I'm his parent....and he definitely didn't want to escalate and lose more priveleges. I'm famous in our house for calmly saying "If you want to make the situation worse and lose x privilege, that is your choice." Normally, we have swim 2-3 times per week that runs until 730, so his normal bedtime is between 830 and 9. But again, after swim practice , he has to unpack his swim bag, rinse/hang up his suit, hang up his wet towel and shower before he does anything else. I do not tell him to do it 99% of the time anymore...he just does it. But DS didn't come out of the box that way, lol...it has taken a lot of time and patience to get to this point. And when we first start part of his routine, I do it with him everyday, too, until it becomes habit. I will say that if he was laying in the floor for more than 30 minutes or so, sinply refusing to pick up Legos, the Legos would be gone for a day or two. I use the same technique in the classroom for items like calculators...if they arent cleaned up, then they are put away for a time. I have also told my kids that if they arent willing to clean up a toy, they must not want to see it tomorrow....and I have had to follow through on this several times when the floor needed to be clean and a mealtime wasnt on the horizon, lol.

@2littlepumpkins: Yes, exactly! You said it better than I did...but that's exactly what I was trying to explain.

My 7 yr old DD puts herself to bed and always washes her hands....but she forgets her lunch and leaves her stuff everywhere. I consider it a success that she knows the routine/where things go/responsibilities even if she doesn’t do it. Why doesn’t she do it if she knows the system and does it sporadically especially with an incentive? She says it from her own mouth-she just doesn’t want to. What is somewhat effective at that point is a countdown followed by a consequence. Fully expecting and believing the consequence is half the battle.

@Mrsbells: same here. My 6 year old will lose tv time for screaming and throwing a fit.

Screaming at me is an absolute no. I will walk away and go into the other room without acknowledging him. He hates that and will apologize pretty quickly.

We are doing baseball too, he loves it, but if his behavior gets really bad we take away a practice or a game. Then I have him tell his coach why he had to miss a game. That straightens him up right away. He hates to disappoint his coach.

As far as getting things done, pick your battles. We have a 17 month old too so my son knows he can't leave his legos out. But other toys? I'm not going to stand and argue that they be cleaned up right then and there. We do a pick up at the end of the night before bed.

I keep reminding myself that he is only 6 years old. Yes, they can have responsibilities but we can't expect them to remember every little thing. I lower my expectations then try to help him understand why things need to be done. His lunchbox needs to go to the sink so it can be clean for the next day. If it isn't clean, he doesn't get lunch from home. His homework folder needs to go back in his bag so he doesn't forget it the next day. We have a routine and I try to stick to it as best as possible. If he wants to watch a show, he has to do a, b and c before then. If he doesn't get it done in time no show before bed.

@irene: I love that sketchbook of life lessons idea!

@irene: RE: consequences. One thing that's helped us figure out good consequences for our sons is asking the question "what can we change about this situation to set all of us up for success?" So sometimes we take away something not necessarily as a punishment, but because we realized through repeat experiences that a certain object or situation isn't helping our kids and ourselves act our best. Its our job as the parent to figure out how to change the circumstance to set our kids up to succeed and to remove the aggravations that make us act poorly as parents.

So for instance, both kids at the age of 2 went through developmental period where TV or any kind of screen time turned them into raging animals. We wouldn't let them watch TV as a result, but even just SEEING the physical TV there or our phones or iPads made them go berserk,. We had crazy tantrums, the works. I don't think it was the shows or the screentime themselves, but more the desire to exert control over certain things. But we just weren't succeeding in that context (success being defined as the toddler acting like a reasonable human being the parents not screaming). So we physically removed the TVs and iPads and access to screens because we were just going to take that fight off the table. It wasn't a punishment per se, it was removing the bone of contention so that we could be kind and happy.

Obviously, things like food is different. You can't NOT give your son dinner. But the timer idea is great, or even giving him like 5 bites of food instead of a full plate so that he can focus better on the 5 bites he has in front of him, finish it quickly, and then tell him he can ask for more when he's done. If he asks why this is so, you would just say "I don't want to fight with you about dinner. I just want to have a nice dinner with you and be a nice mommy. Fighting with you about taking too long to eat makes me sad and mad, so I'm doing this so we can both be happier."

Putting Legos in toy jail is another thing. Its not so much about taking away the toy as a punishment. Its about getting your kid to buy into the unified family goal of harmony and that we can both do things as parent and child to NOT make the other person angry or upset. "I am going to put these Legos away until we can stop fighting about them. I don't like being angry mommy because you don't clean them up, and I know you get mad and sad when mommy yells at you about cleaning up, so we are going to put them away until you decide you can put them away without me asking okay?"

Is it possible baseball is adding to his mental/physical load in a way that is setting him up to be more badly behaved? Like, he's aggravated from the coaching or tired from the stress/exhaustion of practices/games? A kid already has to be under the direction of a teacher all day, then parents at home - adding a coach might be too much for him. I know for our eldest son, for instance, that would be too much for him and wouldn't be setting him up for success. We'd pull him if that were the case.

Anyways, it sounds like you guys are making great progress!

@irene: I agree, it's hard to find natural consequences at times, particularly since my son doesn't always seem to want to "do the right thing." As an example, last year after some particularly bad behavior at school, the principal decided that for a certain activity, my son wouldn't participate with his class, but would instead have to spend the time with him and the assistant principal. I later asked my son about it and he was reported he had a nice day with the principal. So, was that worth it? I don't really know, as it didn't seem to impact my son in the way the principal had hoped.

Another thing is homework. We don't have it our school, but they do send home a weekly reading log. My son hasn't completed it since January, maybe longer. I basically told him it was on him to complete his log and if he didn't do it, he would face the consequences in class with his teacher. Well, guess what, at our conference, the teacher reported that he's above grade level in reading, is a peer coach to help other kids with their writing and basically completes all his work with very little help. So, the reading log doesn't even factor in to their assessments. When I tell other parents we don't do the log they are shocked, but it's working for us.

When you have a minute, can you share the sketchbook? That sounds super interesting.

@gingerbebe: Whoa! Life lessons and new awareness here! Thanks for posting...it struck a chord in me!

@irene: Yeah, I mean there has to be some compromise and understanding on both sides to get this to work. Like, you may need to accept that your son just isn't wired a certain way that makes it easy for him to just do the chores you want him to do. It is very hard to accept this when you're looking at an extremely gifted child, but I LIVE with that kid now as an 38 year old man! My husband can keep track of hundreds of clients and all the details of their cases in his head and he can spew engineering concepts and the exact Code of Federal Regulations citation in conversation, but he can NEVER. FIND. HIS. DANG. SUNGLASSES. because he just leaves his crap all over the house. Or remember to flush the toilet. Or put an empty can in the recycling bin 5 inches from him. Its a mental disconnect I find infuriating as his wife, but he just IS that way. Like, I really had to learn to not take it personally because its just a shortcoming in him that's compensated by his extreme giftedness in other areas. So, part of this may be that you need to ACCEPT that your kid will just plain struggle with these kind of rote tasks.

That said, that doesn't mean you all can't find some ways to meet in the middle. The biggest way we've found peace in our marriage and how DH and his parents found peace was 1) getting DH to buy into the VALUE of doing something and 2) getting him to help come up with the solution to the problem as an active stakeholder. In essence, if he see's why something has to be done, agrees that the doing it has some intrinsic value, and then you agree to a certain WAY or METHOD to accomplishing the task, then you just have to be like "yo, you agreed to this." Granted, your son is 6, so its not like you spit shake to agree and never have to remind him or fight with him again on it, but constantly reinforcing "you agreed to this" helps over time just building something into his routine.

In the Lego example, there could be a few "why" explanations you can give. You can start with "I know you love your Legos and Mommy wants you to have fun and make all sorts of creative things with them. But we have to make sure we clean up the Legos afterwards because...."

1) Stepping on a Lego is painful. You can also slip on a Lego and fall and really hurt yourself. If anyone in our family slipped and fell or hurt themself on a Lego, Mommy/Daddy would get very upset and would probably get mad and sad. This is even something you can physically demonstrate - ask him to put a Lego on the floor and step on it with a barefoot. Or lay down on top of his Legos. Or remind him of a time he slipped and fell.

2) When Mommy sees a million Lego pieces all over the floor, it makes Mommy's brain hurt and it makes it hard for me to think. I can't concentrate on playing with you or thinking about fun things we can do together, because all I can think about are the millions of Legos, all the colors - its like when there is a very loud annoying noise all the time. That gives Mommy a headache and it makes Mommy act grouchy, so cleaning up the Legos really helps Mommy be happier and calmer. You can even make this concrete by let's say blasting really loud noises that are really irritating and say "see? This is what it feels like inside Mommy's brain when I see all the Legos everywhere."

Hopefully one of these reasons resonates with him and he sees the value in cleaning up the Legos. Then you need to engage him in helping find the solution. You might say something like "I know cleaning up Legos is something you don't like to do and its boring. But now that you understand WHY we need to clean the Legos, why don't we think about ways cleaning up the Legos can be easier to do?"

One solution may be to adjust the surface he plays the Legos in. Perhaps its as simple as making a rule where you both agree to ONLY play Legos on top of a sheet and then tying the ends up together in a knot when he's done and shoving it in a closet. That way it takes seconds to clean up and its out of the way (this is what my SIL does with her Lego loving son). Or perhaps you ask him if he thinks playing Legos on something like this would help him clean his Legos up, since its fast and easy:

https://www.amazon.com/Lay-n-Go-Original-Large-Activity-Play/dp/B007BPJTOU

Hopefully then he agrees to the solution, you thank him for helping you come up with a plan, and then for a while, you probably thank him profusely when he follows you by saying something that reinforces the why - "thank you so much for cleaning up the Legos - ahh, Mommy's brain feels so much clearer and I don't have to worry about you hurting your little foot!"

Then there are tasks like pulling his gym clothes out of his bag that might be harder because he might be like "I have a million shirts and shorts, who cares if these are dirty??" In that case, the why reason might not be as compelling or it just may not be age appropriate. DH talks about how he was able to do chores as a kid because his parents just assigned certain things to each person in the family and the WHY was that we are a family and we all live here and we all have to pitch in and do our part because its fair. We share our house, so we share in the work it takes to maintain the house. Daddy has to do all the laundry and its a lot of work, so its FAIR, KIND, and HELPFUL that we all make sure to put the laundry in the hampers so Daddy can do it. But that kind of reasoning may not work at age 6, I don't know. So it may be something like you just try to cut some steps out for him and make it less annoying. You can say something like "I understand you don't like doing this, but we all have to help do the laundry together. So would it be helpful to you if we put a little hamper next to where your backpack goes and you take it to the laundry room when its full instead of every single day?" If he agrees, then bring him in to the solution like, ask him if there's a specific day he'd like to bring the hamper to the laundry room or whatever.

However, if its something like a uniform he needs for a game, the why here might be more compelling, like we have to remember to put the clothes in the laundry because if we don't wash your uniform, it will not be clean for your next game and you could get itchy from wearing a dirty uniform. What do you think we can do to help you remember to put the dirty uniform in the laundry? Would putting a small hamper next to your backpack hook help remind you to put the clothe sin the laundry? Hopefully he says yes, you get him the hamper, and he places his clothes in it. And then before you go upstairs or to bed or transition in the evenings, to say "do we have all our things that we need to take to the laundry?" "Oh did you remember your hamper?" Or something like that.

@irene: My son would freak out if I tried that lego bag....he is currently building a house and he does it little by little. So, what we did is to repurpose a coffee table and that's his lego building area. It's got a shelf underneath that he uses to put the bricks in bins, and then on top, he has several of those large baseplates. We talked a lot about why he has to build on the table and not on the floor...the motivating factor was losing the pieces in the vacuum cleaner. I made my peace with the lego table, it's not pretty, but I love to see the progress. I'll have to snap a photo later for you.

We also really like the Lego Architecture kits...those build up into a city or building and we display them all over the house. For whatever reason, my son is really motivated to keep those intact, as opposed to the other kits, which he builds and then modifies.

Have you tried the 3d puzzles? My son is into those too, and we have them all over as well.

@irene: I get the face from my husband for sure. A common exasperated complaint of his is how HARD it is to pretend to care about stuff that is pointless or dumb or whatever (not just to me, but everything/everyone). He honestly hides is really well (his mother is the sweetest, kindest, most polite person and gets her feelings hurt really easily, so he basically learned to fake caring about stuff from a young age), but he's been open about the fact that it really is a struggle for him. One of the ways I can tell he's "slipping" is when the eye contact kinda wanders - sometimes his eyes start to flutter and it almost looks like he's falling asleep and then I get really mad. He'll snap back and tell me he's NOT falling asleep, he's actually trying REALLY hard to stay engaged and that's why his eye contact is slipping, but that yes, I'm going on too long and I'm losing him. So then I have to stop and regroup, sometimes we have to return to the conversation later, etc.

The long and short of it is, there is no perfect clean solution. You have needs and preferences of your own (i.e. I hate the Lego bag, its ugly) and he has his (cleaning up Legos is boring and pointless, I'm just going to bring them out and play with them again tomorrow), and, you know, he's freaking 6 years old. I keep coming back to the acceptance thing because you just have to meet the kid where he is and acknowledge that it just really is harder for him to do certain things a certain way. It doesn't mean he can't do it, it doesn't mean he cannot learn to incorporate certain "pointless" habits into his life, but it just will take longer and they will probably not be done the way YOU want them to be done. My husband does the dishes in the dumbest way possible and I've just had to let go - like the point is he's doing the dishes, I just need to let it go, I can't fuss about the fact that he loads the dishwasher ass backwards, gets water EVERYWHERE, constantly puts things in the wrong place so I can't find anything (AUGHDFKGKJFDNK) but we've agreed he's in charge of the dishes, he understands its important to me, he's doing them, Amen.

I want to also note that I don't know if MY kids are gifted or whatever (and honestly DH swears they are not), but we try to use the same strategies when parenting our kids because DH just remembers the earliest part of his childhood just so fraught with frustration all the time and we're trying to avoid that as much as possible (because DH was a notorious troublemaker). He really believes he and his parents figuring out a way to collaborate together saved his childhood. On the other end of this, we also have some dear friends who have a son who is now in middle school and he is like the cautionary tale for us. He basically had the same issues and his parents, being typical Chinese immigrant parents, just kept enforcing rules over and over and over again. He was a gifted child in an expensive private school and he was an only child for a very long time so they just thought this is how kids were. But something shifted when the kid turned 9 and he just started actively lying to his parents and his teachers. Forging signatures, not doing his homework, not bringing home his notes from school, etc. And once the parents found out and started punishing him in the traditional sense, it didn't work at all. The kid either completely just checked out and didn't care or he just lost it and went completely off the rails. They took EVERYTHING away from him, he was grounded, etc. Nothing worked. They even pulled him out of private school and put him in regular public school because he was failing out of school. Not because he wasn't smart - the child is gifted - but because he was just over it and at that point he just felt like nothing he did was good enough anyway, so why bother. EVERYTHING seemed pointless for this child. My friends were completely at a loss. The son is still sorta disengaged, but he has come a long way and I can see more empathy and kindness coming from him in our interactions. My friends have had to COMPLETELY 180 their way of parenting and they're like OMG doing this while he's in middle school and going through his teenage moodiness is the WORRRRST, but they are hoping that it pays off in him being happier and better able to function in his family and his day to day life. His grades are stellar since he's gifted, but he's admittedly bored in public school, but his parents and the educators have all agreed right now helping him find balance is more important than giving him extremely challenging academic work.

All this is to say you're doing the Lord's work here and its great you guys are working so hard trying to engage him now while he's young!

@gingerbebe: AAAAAHHHH!!!! I am laughing so hard...I have tears rolling down my face after your first paragraph...the sunglasseses...YES, EXACTLY....so true in my house...

Whew...now that I've caught my breath, I married the history nut that can tell anyone almost anything about any country in the world at the drop of a hat...and processes new scientific information faster than 5G...but last night was complaining he couldn't find "his new blue field day shirt with the anchor on it"...when he was really looking for "his new GREEN field day shirt with the SHIP on it.

Thankfully, while DS1 is highly gifted, he has more of my style of executive function than DH's.

@irene: Wow...have to agree to disagree on the 'child who behaves at school but not at home' vs the 'child who behaves at home and not at school.' I felt slapped in the face when I read that. My eldest struggles with behavior at school, and it is very difficult for the school to meet his needs, as he is 2E. We meet his needs at home, so behavior isn't as much of a struggle at home. Am I to believe that my child will "go to jail" because he has had in school suspension? I went from wanting to be helpful to you to being completely offended. If your child is behaving better at school, maybe you should look to them for advice.