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We're doing well. I had a soy latte yesterday to see if she really has an issue with it (up until now it was just eliminated as a precaution). So far she seems totally fine - fingers crossed!

@LovelyPlum: Bummer! At least it's something you don't eat a lot of, I guess - silverlining kinda? Hope she's feeling better soon!

@LovelyPlum: oh no! I'm so sorry you're still dealing with this! Gah what is up with our babies man.

@fussygal: yay! fingers crossed!

So.. I am maybe a MSPI dropout?

Last I updated I had eliminated all dairy and soy and LO was improving on her eating. After 2 weeks I added back soy (just the little bits in packaged food. No like... soy milk or anything) and after 4 days she seemed to be getting increasingly gassy and then started having bright green super mucous poops. WTF? This was confusing because she never had those before I cut out dairy and soy (her only real symptom was the food refusal). Although I did realize after I cut dairy/soy and started her on the nutramigen that her poop changed and I think it was somewhat mucous-y before and I didn't realize thats what that meant until I saw normal poop.

So I decided she was allergic to soy. And quite honestly pumping was making me miserable so DH and I talked about it and decided to just put her on 100% nutramigen and me to stop pumping. She was on 2/3 nutramign anyways and doing great. So as of Friday night she got just nutramigen and I started weaning off of pumping. Mucous poops went away within 2 days but then Monday she had two (not mucousy) army green poops (god I hate how much I talk about poop now. seriously).

So I called the ped Tues morning and they said that color isn't really important (unless it is red black or white) but mucous is and it sounds like she IS allergic to soy so sticking with the nutramigen is the best bet. They also asked how many times/day she goes and I said pretty much always 1, maybe 2 (and they said great she shouldn't really be going more than that).

Then of course she pooped 5 times yesterday. What the hell?! She hasn't done that in months.

Also her sleep has gone to absolutely shit (expected-- she is 16 weeks so I guess 4 mo regression a little early?), but also she has been incredibly fussy. Like unbelievably fussy. Just a little fussy sat-sun. A little more mon. Yesterday she whined and cried all day long. Today so far hasn't been AS bad but still tons of whining and crying. I know this is probably tied to the crap sleep/wonder week/regression but I have this worry in the pit of my stomach that it has to do with switching her off of bm entirely??

Oh also she has been a drool MACHINE. She's always been drooly but the last week has been crazy. Like soak through a bib in under 10 minutes drool. So then I wonder if the drool could have caused the mucous poop and maybe she isn't allergic to soy. And I also wonder if she's teething early and thats why she's been impossible.

God I wish babies came with error codes. Plug 'em in and find out what's wrong, just like when your check engine light goes on.

@LovelyPlum: So sorry Hoping things get better before your appt on Monday and that you find answers there!

@LovelyPlum: BIG HUGS!!! i hope that the doc is more attentive to her needs than just to say "switch to formula" - that doesn't seem like it should be the right answer to me. I'm so sorry she's suffering still. I hope you get some answers and support on monday!

@Mrs. Deer: welcome! i haven't trialed her yet, but i'm planning to over the next week (trying to let her get over the cold she has and we just introduced egg so i wanted to wait a few days). she will be 9 months next week and we were planning on starting with a few small bites of yogurt like you did, because i'd heard it was best. Since it has been so long, you could try yogurt again or she's old enough that you could also try WCM (in a very small amount). From what i've read, there's no right answer, but it's definitely encouraging that you were able to tolerate small amounts of dairy while BF as well! We decided we're going to trial my LO directly rather than me eating it because it takes so long for it to be out of my milk. I would say not to start with baked dairy only because I think the fewer ingredients the better so you know there's nothing else causing an issue. but at 20 months, that might not be relevant for you if LO is eating everything else at this point. I hope she does better this time around!!!! btw what did you switch to as a WCM alternative when you weaned?

@Pirouette: thanks! Maybe we will revisit yogurt. I think baked dairy would be fine for her since it's such a small amount and she did do better with my dietary changes while breastfeeding. I just hate to risk her throwing up, always makes me so sad

we didn't end up doing any milk substitute. She's really picky about what she drinks and doesn't even really like juice! We just make sure she gets lots of healthy fats (avocado, but butters) and protein.

@Mrs. Deer: I'm in the same boat as you--terrified of trialing any dairy or soy. Since just a month ago, LOs poops were black and tar like after just 1 lick of a stolen cheesy poof (from a baby friend), I'm afraid to do the real stuff.

I should probably make another appt. with the GI doctor to ask how it should be introduced, but I just felt meh about them in our first visits, so we stopped going.

how's everyone doing?

so we decided to trial dairy! we gave her a little yogurt Monday evening and then 2x yesterday. She's eaten about 3/4 of a small individual sized chobani yogurt. So far she hasn't shown any reaction, but I'm wondering how long it takes for her body to process it. how long should i wait before trying something other than yogurt? Also not sure how long I should stay dairy free to make sure it's not in my milk if she has a delayed reaction? Anyone have any advice/ideas? I was thinking of giving her a week or two with just the yogurt, then trying cheese, then if she does ok on the cheese, i could introduce small amounts to my diet.

Please cross your fingers for us that she doesn't have any reaction at all!!

@Pirouette: I gave her yogurt in the morning a few weeks ago. She loved it, so I gave her maybe 3-4 tablespoons.

Just yesterday, I tried scrambled eggs with milk, and she did fine with that too. I haven't tried cheese yet, but that's next. I'm still only giving her 1 meal a day most of the time, so I'm waiting until 8 months to have her eat it on a regular basis.

I only waited 3 days in between introducing new foods. My friend who has a son who had a dairy reaction said it showed up as a rash for yogurt about 6-12 hours after he ate it. And cheese showed up immediately around his mouth.

ETA: That's great that there's no reaction!! Hopefully it continues that way! I treated each new dairy product as a "new food" so if i ate yogurt, I waited 3 days to eat cheese, then 3 days to eat ice cream/milk.

Hi all, @LovelyPlum: invited me to join you here (thanks!) and it'll take me time to read the archives and catch up, but here's my intro for the meantime:

LO's age?
Just about 4 months (in a few days)

Sensitivities? How do they react? When/how did you find out?
No diagnosis yet but something is definitely up. Green, slimy poops started early, around 2 weeks old. Ped suggested oversupply and fore/hindmilk imbalance, block feeding ever since has mostly resolved the green, but mucus lingers. About a month ago we had a green one with flecks of blood, had a negative bacterial stool culture, blood/green cleared up so ped suspected viral. Meanwhile all poops are still kinda mucous. Then this week and last we twice more had the flecks of blood, so I'm pretty sure it's something in my diet. He also seemed to spit up more on the blood days, and has had a persistent diaper rash. DH is sensitive to wheat and dairy so I'm suspicious of those. Coffee seems to correlate, though I guess that's not a common culprit.

Are you BFing?
Yes, EBF. Right now I feel like everything I eat is suspect except fruits/veggies, so I don't know what to give up or what is safe!

Words of wisdom to share?
Not yet...

@LovelyPlum: I'm so glad that your appointment went pretty well. It's weird because there are often not answers to come from these appointments; our doctor spent a good deal of time going over the existing science and disagreements among pediatric GI's across the country and how there often isn't a lot of rhyme or reason to it. But he took us seriously, explained what they DO know, and helped us to come up with a plan that suits our needs. ANYWAY. I'm glad you left feeling positive, because I know how mega-nervous I was.

As for us, we are in a weird place right now. Everything is good with Ben's bloody poops -- haven't seen anything suspect since early August. But I've accidentally (and sorta on purpose) had both dairy and soy in early September with no reaction whatsoever. Never a large amount, and I always went right back to dairy/soy free right after, so maybe it's just not enough to trigger a reaction? But with no reaction, I am playing around with things a little. Trying out goat cheese tonight!

@anandam: sorry to see you here, but welcome! I agree it makes sense to eliminate more than you may need to just so you don't drag it out trying to figure out the cause. I thought that wheat could possibly be an issus but maybe not so I eliminated it and will try to reintroduce soon.

@gilmoregirl: glad that your lo didn't react to small amounts of dairy and soy! Good luck with the goat cheese! Last weekend I had some salad at a wedding with dressing on it and we had bloody poops the next day for almost a full week, so it sounds really promising that you didn't experience something similar!
@Pirouette: @abbydabbydoodlebug: so great that your los seem to be taking the dairy so well!
@LovelyPlum: glad that you are being taken seriously now. Our ped doubted my suspicions even after 4 diapers tested positive for blood. It wasn't until the last appointment when I made a big deal about how much better he is eating and acting and how his poop is normal now that he conceded he may have been wrong.

Looking for some advice from you experienced mamas...

Our pediatrician really doesn't suspect a food intolerance because the symptoms are inconsistent, she suspects anal fissures, but she said to keep a food diary and see if anything correlates from the previous 24 hours whenever we see a bloody green stool.

So on closer examination of every diaper we are seeing blood more often than I thought, twice in the past week. But some days are yellow and curdy and normal. LO is gassy and spits up some days more than others but generally happy and sleeps and eats well. Looking at my food log I don't see any clear suspects.

When you all were narrowing down causes, did you notice that eating something one day would always worsen symptoms within 24 hours? Was there ever more of a delay? Or is it not so clear - some days baby seems affected by the problem food, some days not?

@anandam: i'd say before i eliminated dairy, there wasn't a clear correlation, whereas once i had eliminated it, there was a pretty quick reaction if i had any incidents. from what i understand, milk protein intolerance basically means the intestines become inflamed when you have milk protein, but that doesn't necessarily mean you immediately see the impact. so you could have blood any amount of time later, because the milk protein caused the inflammation, and if let's say you have a milk intolerance, it could take multiple instances before it would rise to the level of mucous/blood passing through to the poop.

Does that make sense? I'm not a doctor, this is just how i understood it from LO's ped!

@Baby Boy Mom: @Pirouette: @gilmoregirl: So helpful, this all makes perfect sense, thank you! Did you all eliminate dairy first because it's most often the problem? Or did you eliminate more things at first? How long till bowel symptoms improved?

I did cut out most dairy last week (had a little butter and cream a couple times) and will be stricter now, but curious to hear your experiences so I can sort of feel less blind!

@anandam: I eliminated dairy first and then added soy to my list after five weeks of no dairy hadn't made a difference. After 8 weeks off both, his diapers cleared up and we haven't had a problem since. I don't think the length of time we saw is the norm at all. I did have to label read though -- which means a lot of breads and cereals, etc are off the table because they contain the milk protein.

Kellymom has a helpful cheat sheet:

http://www.kellymom.com/store/freehandouts/hidden-dairy01.pdf

After his diapers were clear for a month, I started challenging a little and trying things here and there (ie, a granola bar that had soy in it, a tiny amount of parmesan cheese on my pasta, goat cheese) and so far we have had no issues. I had a soymilk latte yesterday, so I'm waiting to see how that turns out.

@anandam: I did both dairy and nuts at the same time (not really something I recommend, fwiw). My baby seemed to get super sick right after I had a ton of almonds, but everyone said to try dairy first, so I just went with both. In the end, I had to keep eliminating (she ended up definitely sensitive to soy too, plus some undetermined things). But just the dairy, soy, and nuts was enough to make a huge difference for us in the beginning.

If it helps, my pedi told me that she would normally recommend cutting dairy, soy, wheat, and eggs in that order as first suspects. She also mentioned that sometimes babies who are really sensitive to soy will have an issue with legumes because they are similar, or babies with a dairy issue will also have a problem with beef. In the end, it is really just trusting your gut and (dare I say it) a bit of luck. I eliminated sooo many things and we still never figured out all her problems. But at 12 months, she is outgrowing them slowly but surely anyway.

@anandam: Yes, I did. My LO saw one pediatrician in our practice (not his usual dr) who wanted me to put him on formula right away, but I refused. Every other LC and doctor (including our pediatric GI) was supportive of my insistence that we continue breastfeeding.

What symptoms does he have? How is he doing in general? The advice I got that really helped was to treat the baby and not the poop. So, we were seeing bloody poop and it was upsetting, but my son was happy, growing, and otherwise unaffected. We kept doing what we were doing.

I know it doesn't help, but I really feel for you. I drove myself CRAZY trying to figure out what was causing the bloody poops, overanalyzing my diet and his diapers. It was so, so frustrating and awful. And then one day it just got better, with no additional changes from me. I'm still not sure that MSPI is definitely what was going on for us; it's all pretty nebulous though.