Hellobee Boards

@Adira: I stand by that. But I also think a lot of people posting here in "outrage" haven't researched the issue very well and don't care enough to get up and do something real...as I pointed out in my second post.

I had a foster child who was removed from his home because his birth mother had a meth addiction. Drug use is often a misdemeanor, although this parent was not charged with any crime. By your logic, the government traumatized her child by taking him away and making him cry. By my logic, the parent traumatized her child through her choices. Where does parental responsibility begin/end here?

https://www.newsandguts.com/breaking-homeland-security-drafting-order-end-family-separation/

@tlynne: whoa. Let’s not equate parents seeking asylum from atrocities that we cannot imagine who choose to cross at an unauthorized part of the border rather than a designated point of entry with meth addicts. I could argue that the absolute height of parental responsibility is doing any and everything it takes to to move your family to safety.

@tlynne: excuse me, where do you get off accusing people of not “researching well” when they don’t agree with you? When you’re the one who responded to remarks about children in cages with “that picture was from four years ago,” completely disregarding the dozens of photos plastered all over the news in recent days?

@nwm: yes. Preach

I hope if I end up in a situation needing help people treat me with more respect and compassion then a lot of what I’ve seen. People think it can’t happen to them and I think we’re closer then they know. When trump got elected I told my family internment camps aren’t that far in our past (I have mixed race children) but people are so quick to forget. This could happen to anyone depending on dictators whims. We’re are also alienating countries with our behavior.

God help us

Did anyone see the state department Facebook live about traveling with children and everyone was asking questions like are my kids white enough to return to the us and what type of pajamas go best with tin foil blankets?

@tlynne: Your point is a false equivalency. It's really nice that you are a foster mom and have taken in a child whose parents are addicted to meth. That doesn't factor into the discussion whether separating children from their parents at our borders and imprisoning those children is morally right or legal in terms of international law regarding human rights.

A person doesn't need to be a foster parent to have an opinion about general morals regarding children or to understand international human rights law--they just need to be a voting U.S. citizen.

Truthfully, your arguments are something I see pretty often on social media, since I grew up in small town West Texas and have a lot of family in small town Georgia, and both of these places are majority republic and have veered very hard right, when compared to the "compassionate conservatism" of the George H years when I was growing up. In my attempts to understand the people I grew up with that believe similarly to you, that the US government is totally justified in traumatizing, criminalizing, and imprisoning these children, I have asked questions. And I have seen a lot of similar replies to yours. You seem pretty angry, and you deflect, and then you bring up the fostering as a response, and then you told Adira she doesn't have a valid opinion because she's not a foster parent.

I'm honestly just trying to understand-is there anywhere you would draw a line and say "this is not humane. This is not how humans should be treated"? What would it take?

Do you think it makes economic sense for the U.S. government to house/feed/provide case workers/social workers/childcare workers for these people rather than start issuing temporary work visas and letting them work and contribute to society and pay taxes? I just want to know more about your line of thought about this situation. You don't find it morally repugnant, that's clear. You believe that these children and their parents "deserve it" because they showed up at a time right after the US changed from a non-criminal, civil offense to a "0 tolerance" criminal defense. Do you prefer for the U.S. to spend billions to house these people because we criminalized illegal entry? Can you think of any more humane or any better economic alternatives that you would sign on to?

@gotkimchi: good for them! How about the DHS lead who had the audacity to go out to eat at a fucking Mexican restaurant in DC and got heckled? I’m all for it.

For everyone reading this thread. Depression or feeling helpless is a normal response, but it's a really indulgent response, too. *Many* of us are relatively privileged and we have to get it together and keep fighting. You're feeling fatigue from calling your senators and reps? Me too. We have to keep at it.

This is just one more moment of truth in American history. Don't forget that during the Civil Rights movement, there were white people fighting integration every single step of the way. Don't forget that the FBI was trying as hard as it could to dig up dirt on MLK jr to discredit the entire civil rights movement. Don't forget that the MAJORITY of the white people in the entire segregated south wanted Rosa Parks to stay in her place on the back of the bus because it was a law, and they just wanted everyone to follow the law as it was written then and stay in their oppressed place. By the way, most of those same white people are alive today. Is it any surprise that they are pro Trump and anti immigration? No. Why are we surprised? We can't reason with these people. There are some people whose minds can be changed, I do believe that, but our time and energy now is best spend mobilizing our side, getting out the vote, protesting, and changing public opinion through raising consciousness.

Vent online when you need to. And then spend the same amount of time with actionable items. (this is a pep talk I have to give myself all the time). Keep donating your money, keep calling congress, keep voting on a local level (THOSE elections make the most change. Your state government can defund ICE, can refuse to have police cooperate with ICE, can refuse to send national guard to the border, etc).

@Anagram: Word!

@Anagram: Thanks for the encouragement. The harder it gets, the harder we need to fight!

@gotkimchi: As an immigrant myself and surrounded by friends/families that are immigrants, sigh, I totally get that state of mind you're in

Have ya'll seen this spreadsheet yet? It lists companies profiting from building detention centers and detaining kids.

https://docs.google.com/document/u/1/d/16Z04gxhORlgmS5sDhnX_ryDfSF8T2a6AwZWV1PMY-H8/mobilebasic

@gotkimchi: I'm Christian and don't even get my started on him quoting the Bible to justify what he's doing

@Mrs. Carrot: yes yes yes. Please everyone do their research. I know everyone here’s heart is in the right place but as advocates, we need to be accurate.

@pinkcupcake: totes the same

Have a quick question. So I call daily on my lunch break but NY is already represented by Dems that are for stopping this insanity.

Can I call states with Rep senators? Would my call matter?

@bloop: While I agree with your last sentence, the name calling is absurd and doesn't help anyone. Trump's polling numbers are hovering in the 40% for people that approve of the job he's doing. 40-some percent. We can't back people into a corner based on past beliefs. Anyone can make a change, but they won't when they feel attacked.

There are reports that there are two republican proposed House bills coming up that would keep families together in detention centers. But the chatter is that the bills will also have funding for the border wall in the text.

Do you think the "small government" republicans (are there any left?) want this either-or situation where either our tax dollars are paying for billions of dollars of border walls or billions of dollars on detention centers?

@bloop: @Anagram: yep. Also, she opposes the family separation policy, so...... I’m bowing out of this thread after this, but honestly, it does more harm than good to the causes that we are trying to advance when folks on our own side of the table refuse to actually listen to what others are saying. It wasn’t good enough that she said she opposes the family separation policy, she’s still heartless bc she has different opinions about immigration as a whole. Jesus people, we ARE as bad as Twitter Trump if the only opinions we want to hear are our own.