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@grizz: HAHA! I was reading through everyone's responses but it took too long so I just skipped to page 2 to reply, and saw this post

After paying for a sleep consult, we picked a time before which we knew LO "shouldn't" be hungry. She was eating around 7pm and going to bed at 7:30pm. At the time, maybe 5.5-6 months?, she was waking up at 1am-2am, then again at 4am, up for the day at 6ish. I was REALLY torn because it seemed "tolerable", ie not waking every hour like some folks, but also that seemed like poor sleep for someone her age. The pediatrician said let her CIO. The sleep consultant suggested picking a time.

Soooo we said 2am was the magic time before which we wouldn't feed her. She woke at 1am, then midnight the night or two before our consultation. The night after our consultation, her first waking was at 11pm. That actually made it easier because we knew she couldn't be hungry! So we braced to let her cry. She cried for 11 mins then fell back asleep, and didn't wake until 4:30am. The next week, we did the same thing a few times, and we were really lucky that she never cried for very long (I wouldn't hope for this outcome though).

Things have been much better since then - she has only ever woken up once to eat in the night (I have learned sleep training won't magically make her not hungry at all). A few times she'll still randomly wake at 2-3am, and I do feed her, but usually it's closer to 4am. Since we got back from vacation last week (LO is now 7.5 months), she's been sleeping through til 5:30am most nights, then back to sleep til 7:30. Best sleep of her life so far.

We still let her cry for 5-10 mins before getting her just to be sure she's 'really' hungry, but overall her sleep has really improved since the CIO week. NOBODY wants to hear their LO cry. But sleep is the most important possible thing for your physical and mental health and ability to be a good mom and wife. So don't judge yourself too harshly.

We ended up doing it at 4 months. I don't think anyone goes into parenthood wanting to force their child to CIO, but for us, it was the only options.

It was taking us 2 hrs to put in sleep and he would wake up every 2 hours. It was killing us and him. He'd be cranky and crabby all day and I knew that his lack of sleep at night was affecting his ability to sleep during the day...it was just a vicious cycle.

Anyway, we did a modified CIO with checkins every 5-10 mins. The first night was the most difficult and he cried for almost an hour, but after that, it went down to 30 mins, and then 15 mins, and then on the fourth night, he was asleep with no crying at all.

It was difficult to handle at the time, but I think it was well worth it. He's been a great sleeper ever since.

@grizz: you should check out http://www.thesleepstore.co.nz - it's a New Zealand website but it has heaps of really good information for all sorts of scenarios.

If you do go with a Sleep consultant make sure they take into account your routine (feeding, playing, napping etc) across the whole day as you might be able to make some adjustments during the day that will help at night. Also - a sleep consultant who's only tool is some form of CIO isn't any good, in my opinion!

We co slept until 11 months and it just wasn't working anymore - up every hour, squirming/kicking/rolling, not going to bed until 11pm; you name it he did it.

First night he screamed and screamed. It was heartbreaking. I hated it. Second night it took 3 minutes. It was definitely a process.

But now at 16 months he gets a bottle with the lights off at 7, and into his crib he goes. Right now the rule is if he cries for 10 minutes then I will get him and rock him back to sleep. Then he goes back in and stays there until he goes to sleep. This also happens if he wakes in the MotN.

Good luck !

@grizz: aww, honey! I just want to give you a big hug!! I am so sorry. It is so hard hearing them cry. Have you just put him down and walked away for a bit?

@grizz: I'm so sorry.

*hugs* We sleep trained at six months, modified CIO with resettling every five minutes. LO had been waking every forty five minutes for her paci, we were still totally reliant on swaddling and I was heading toward a PPD relapse when we sleep trained.

It was so hard for me to get past the AP attitude toward CIO, but my reality just didn't match the rhetoric of "Just embrace those precious moments of nursing and cuddling to sleep." Uh, whut? Clearly these people hadn't met my baby. Because nursing to sleep never worked, and "cuddling" meant bouncing on a fitness ball for hours while LO arched her back, howled and clawed at my face from exhaustion.

You are 100% doing the right thing by yourself and your family by sleep training at this point. Sleep is by no means perfect in my house, but its a whole lot better. My only advice is to have a clear plan of action for tomorrow night. And to take care of yourself during the process. Glass of wine, hot bath, comfort food , tv - whatever works for you.

@grizz: I forget, does your SO work nights?? I feel like mama hormones make us react more than dads, which unfortunately might wind LOs up more. Can you pawn off the settling on him?

@grizz: oh no. I want to give you a big hug. That sounds so rough! it's so hard to watch them get so worked up.

@grizz: one more thing, have you considered full extinction? I hate to suggest it, but I know my LO was made so much angrier by checks that it was ultimately quicker just to go full-on.

I also suggest weissbluth, but for a different reason....after I read it, I had a better grasp on what the "rules" we're for baby sleep and I was able to make tweaks to our routine that made it better.

The biggest thing for my son is that sleep begets sleep, but for us, the naps are what matters. My son needs his daytime sleep, do we were at 2 naps for a long time after most kids drop to one.

Thinking of you, I know it is difficult.

@Mrs. Sketchbook: @looch: This. I also suggest reading either Weissbluth or Ferber- even if you do not follow their methods, they taught me sooooo much about baby sleep and how many hours they need, awake times, good bedtime routines, etc.

I am so so sorry Mama that sounds horrible. Is C around 6 months? I remember M going through a awful awful phase around then where she acted like going in her crib was torture. Screaming like a banshee. We ended up sleep training around 6.5 months by staying in the room with her until she fell asleep. The first night was horrible and took 45 minutes, and it gradually got better. We still had 1-2 wakeups to eat for awhile, but it was much better than what we had before.

I am so so sorry you're going through this. We were at our wits end when we sleep trained, and I think for a lot of us that's the only way to feel ok about doing it. Out LOs are similar with their sleep I believe. (I've been relating to you and C since these junebugs were born!) I was depressed an resentful and had literally no time to myself because I passé out at 630 when he went to bed (to be up every hour or so) and he needed to be held for naps. It felt like a marathon of chaos. He started to become miserable too. We did Ferber checks as recommended by a friend with two LOs. It was really hard, DH definitely had to do it while I hid in the shower for as long as it took- never more than 20 minutes really and that was just the first few days. I'm happy to talk more in depth bout the process too if you like. Let me know. I feel like I'm on the other side for the most part now, and can actually understand enjoying motherhood. It's incredible and I attribute my family's current happiness 100% to sleep training.

I also want to add that at this point (15m) she's only nursing once a day, so when she was your LO's age, we usually nursed am, before nap, after nap, before nap, after nap, before bed. and then overnight as needed.

@grizz: I am a big fan of schedules, but more of a "loose" schedule. Routines are great and lots of LO's thrive on them, my LO included. At 7 months, he is probably on 2 or 3 naps depending on how long they are, and eating 2ish meals along with nursing? At that age, my LO could handle about 2-3 hours of awake time in between naps, depending on how long they were. She did best with slightly more awake time before bed. You will get a feel for what your LO can handle. The key is just being consistent. Do the same routine before every nap and bedtime, and he will come to expect it is time to sleep soon.

@grizz: I know you thought about the Isis sleep consult a while ago. I still think you should consider it. They do not always recommend CIO and they will talk to you about the schedule for your whole day. I found them very knowledgable. And while we are not there yet, we have seen some progress and a light at the end of the tunnel. I was very frustrated after reading several sleep books and having trouble implementing them. It was hard to know what to do. That is because there isn't a right answer. It depends on you and your baby. That is where I thought the consult was helpful. They just helped us come up with a manageable plan that works for us. Good luck!