Hellobee Boards

@mrsjazz: I think what I was saying today was misread and no matter how much I corrected myself or restated what I meant, I wasn't being heard so I see what you are saying. i hate that I caused so much drama and I will own that my feelings got hurt. I'm sorry that bothered people so much but I'm an emotional person. Ugh, basically I wanted to say I agree lol

@LindsayInNY: I'm guilty of this but in my defense it's hard to know what is what. I mean I feel like it could also be hurtful to some if someone graduates and then just ignores all of those that were so supportive to them on their journey. I just want people to know that I am on their side and haven't forgotten about them. I also post on other due date boards though and kind of anywhere. I'm always polite and usually it's just to offer congratulations or support. I am not sure that I think a public forum should be off limits to anyone so long as what they post is appropriate. I'm not sure who decides what appropriate though because it can be so subjective. I'm so sorry for any pain my posts may have caused you. They were never intended to be salt in the wound.

@Adira: that happens to me all the time! I think I am saying one thing and it gets so twisted and my character assassinated. I can handle it but I will admit it did upset me a few times.

@mrsjazz: I think maybe I'm less aware of those particular users you're referring to. Maybe I'm one of them? Maybe I'm part of the "clique" and so I'm not attacked by them? Either way, I completely agree that being purposely rude or snarky is uncalled for and I hope that some of the changes Mr. Bee wants to instill will help with these issues.

@ladybee: I completely understand why you feel that way. Looking back at it, I definitely regret posting it and can see how it fueled the drama and helped others to gang up on you, which really was not my intention. I would never purposely do that to someone and I do really regret that my involvement ended up being like that. I really am sorry.

@Adira: I don't read your posts, I think we are in different places so I don't know why people may think you're a "big jerk" but I'm sure your posts are not coming from a hurtful or mean place. Do you re-read your posts before posting them and consider how someone else may take it?

For instance, posts about people whining about babies doing baby things (making messes, crying, pooping on them...) really get to me because of what I've lost. I just ignore most of these posts because I know it's normal to complain but if someone were to make multiple posts like this I would definitely think less of the poster. I know when I post I try to be sensitive to people with lives complicated by very many things and always try to post from a personal, helpful place and if my post isn't then I don't post. I hope this is personal and helpful

@Ms.Badger: (hugs) and very well said. I've been TTC for 2.5 years and I hide the pregnancy boards for a similar reason... It's hard to see people complaining about something you want so badly. I like what you said about trying to be helpful and personal in your responses.

@Ms.Badger: Hmm... that's an interesting question. I probably do NOT think about all the ramifications of how a post could be taken. But I think that could be hard to do. I mean, just posting about my child could be construed as insensitive to someone who is suffering IF or has lost theirs. Or posting about having to pump all the time to keep your supply up could be insensitive to those that really wanted to breastfeed and couldn't.

@Ms.Badger: I was sooo like that after losing S. I just kept thinking "at least you have your baby" about everything, including labor stories. My loss wasn't nearly as difficult as yours, so I can imagine it is x 1000 for you.

In the end, I have M, and he doesn't sleep well. But I have him. I make a point to rarely complain about it. Cause theres people ttc, with IF and incredible losses. My experience has definitely taught me to count my blessings.

The pain never goes away. But it does get better.

@Adira: Exactly! Posts can be hard to take if they are thoughtless. You should definitely post about your child, but make sure it's in the right category (in case people have boards hidden because of issues) and without judgement. "My kid is a horrendous mess and I can't stand it anymore! comes off a lot differently than "does anyone have any ideas on how to keep DS from drawing on himself?" A little care with wording can make something inflammatory or not.

@Ms.Badger: Ah, yes, I agree with that! Posting in the right board is very important, whether it's a new post or responding to someone's post! And I can definitely see how certain wording can be more offensive than others. Thanks for sharing your perspective with me.

@Adira: Thank you and I believe that your intentions weren't how they first appeared.

In reference to the change of tone, I often feel out of the core because DH and I are middle class. Probably lower middle class at that. I can't afford a $40,000 car, a Kate Spade diaper bag, and expensive flats for my kid. While I don't begrudge anyone for having that it does make me feel like I can't participate in some threads. I think others would agree.

Oh, I also don't follow some of the current parenting trends. While I have no problem with those that do. I don't co-sleep, I can't afford to stay at home, I formula feed (by choice) and I don't baby wear. I'm also pro-CIO. Those things tend to make me unpopular.

I'm totally guilty of being a bitch. I have noticed the tone change and with it so did mine. I've realized this over the last few days and have been trying to correct it. So, if I have offended anyone, I apologize. I know, I have made threads and gotten attacked for no apparent reason, and it hurt, but I got over it. Ultimately, at the end of the day, that person doesn't have any hold over my life and there are enough people here who support me to make up for those bad times.

As for what HB needs? I'm not sure. I think some users need to realize they could be nicer, it is after all the internet and people DO have feelings behind these screens. AND, on the other hand, I think other users need to be less sensitive, it is the internet after all and text can be misinterpreted.

@ladybee: I don't think that you're all that different - it's just that sometimes that there are those who are a certain way that may tend to be more vocal. For example, there may be more threads about breastfeeding because there is a learning curve. And I actually feel most of us here WOHM, at least part time. I think sometimes certain things dominate when only it's a few users who are that way. I am less than middle class - heck I'm paying for a college tuition for myself right now while working what many would deem an inferior job where my entire paycheck pays just for daycare so I can go to school and my husband just took a pay cut to avoid being laid off.
But either way - having a mix makes a healthy dynamic in my mind. I have actually heard some SAHMs say that everyone here is WOHM and some WOHM who say it's mostly SAHM here. So sometimes it's a matter of perspective too

I've been trying to think of a way to articulate my feelings on this topic all night. I'm honestly not sure I know how.

First, I want to acknowledge that I have definitely witnessed some clique-like behavior, snarkiness, and overall bitchiness on this site. I don't think these negative behaviors are attributed solely to a single group of users, and that many of us have participated in one way or another. I mean, we all have bad days that cause us to project our emotions onto others. Some of us have been insensitive. Some outright bitchy. I know that I have had my moments of bitchiness. I think it is important we all reflect on our own behavior and own up to it.

The gang mentality has certainly got out of hand. Again, I think it happens on both sides of the argument. Sometimes we get defensive, sometimes we want to protect our friends, often times we don't realize that we are ganging up. Mrs. Tiz eloquently pointed out in the other thread that it is important that we take notice to context when we +1. It is ok to agree with another user, but take the time to be your own person and write out your own response. I feel like some users tend to fan girl other users and +1 everything they say. We are all intelligent women capable of articulating our own thoughts.

Finally, I feel like people are taking things waaaaayyyy too personally. The idea of us all holding hands while singing kumbaya and passing the sharing stick is absurd. We are going to disagree. We are going to have arguments. Some threads are going to get heated. That's life. I totally understand how difficult it is to have a dissenting opinion but we are all adults. If you have an opinion, own it. Who cares if you get flamed by a handful of users? I don't understand the, "I'm afraid to post my opinion in fear of the 'mean girls'" statements. In the grand scheme of life, does it really matter if <insert user name here> doesn't like you because he/she formed an opinion based upon your views on a single topic? If you think there is a clique problem, and you don't like it, why perpetuate it by letting them get away with their bullying? (Disclaimer: I don't necessarily think there is bullying, but it is a recurring theme in many of the HB complaints).

It breaks my heart to see so many users leave today. I also hate that so many users who could be meaningful contributors are not feeling welcomed. We need to stop being dicks and stop getting butt hurt at the drop of the dime. This is an amazing community, with amazing members, and if we all take the time to own up and reflect on our own roles in this nonsense we should be able to turn things back around.

I've only been on here for a few months and have spent most of my time on the IF threads. And, due to a recent loss, I've hidden the Pregnancy/Due Date Boards as well as some Parenting, I think. That said, other than the Duggar thread this morning (which I did read), is there an 'Exhibit A,' that would give me a better understand where the concern for excessive snark and lack of respect is coming from? Not trying to stir things up...just trying to understand.

@Ms.Badger:

@ladybee: I sometimes feel like there's a TON of SAHMs here as well and not nearly as many WOHMs, but I realize that I may not actually know everyone's working status. I'm a WOHM too and we can't afford new cars or designer things either. Our splurges are more like ordering pizza on the weekend! And a lot of our furniture is from Target. I tend to just not even open some of the threads I can't even relate to. Kate Spade bag? I don't even think I've seen one in person!

I think everyone should read this: http://momastery.com/blog/2013/06/21/quit-pointing-your-avocado-at-me/

I felt like some of the "I want to show my kids women can be financially independent etc" comments were getting under my skin. You know what? That's about me, not them.

I am sorta flabbergasted that people are so worked up either way; but apparently that means I am a mean girl, if I don't "see it".

@scg00387: I don't think not seeing it makes you a mean girl. Why do you feel that way?

@ladybee: It does feel like there are more well to do people here. I'm not sure if I'm saying it right but I get the feeling that well to do people just have more time to post maybe? Sorry just throwing out a theory.

We are kind of in the middle. Definitely don't have money to throw around but we are comfortable. I'm a WOHM.

@ShootingStar: your last paragraph resonated for me. Parenting is such a Deeply personal thing, our relationship with our kids are so hugely Important- I think people are easily offended because of what they are trying to protect, you know?
But, we all need to get over that. It comes in part from mommy martyr complexes- we have to be The Best and sacrifice no matter what. And so when someone implies that we aren't, we feel defensive, hurt, guilty, etc.

Honestly, I just get annoyed sometimes. Like "in real life." I trying my best to be a big girl, but sometimes people just annoy me. I vent privately.
That said, I the interest of personal transparency, I'm less active because I found myself increasingly annoyed. And it's the more subtle, passive digs that annoy me, because those folks never get called out. When people make comments implying that there is a "best way" to do something, or that they have All The Knowledge because they googled some stuff, it's either an intentional, or maybe unintentional, way of making other people feel like shit for their choices. And when that is about parenting- of course people get offended.
Someone else gave this example, and I will repeat it: saying that you would never sleep train on a thread where some is asking for help with sleep training is a dick move.

So, am I getting annoyed because of my own insecurities? Probably. I can own that.
I guess my point is: self reflection about why you are being triggered by someone else (even if they are actually being a jerk) is always good. And, some self awareness before you comment about the fact that everyone here is doing the best they can, and probably struggling deeply with all the normal insecurities, self doubt, and desperate love that comes with parenthood.

And, finally, conflict will happen. It is a natural part of human relationships. Conflict does not have to equal drama, however, if people can be direct, honest, and accountable.