Hellobee Boards

I think in today's world, if you are sending your younger child into the restroom or dressing rooms alone, you're just asking for trouble. (In light of all the sex trafficking, child predators, etc. but especially the trafficking has been on my mind lately as it's been a big issue in our area.) So regardless of what you think of transgender people, I think that argument (the most common one I've heard about their being more of a danger now) is completely absurd - we should all be watching our kids closely anyways! It's called parenting and their are potential threats everywhere and the very remote possibility that someone may abuse this policy doesn't bother me because there were already potential threats just because there are creeps out there and it doesn't take a new policy to bring them out.

And at any rate, my Target already has combined dressing rooms. We had a remodel a few years back and they went to a single, larger dressing room with large individual stalls and then all of the bathrooms have individual stalls unless you are using a urinal. Use a stall and mind your own business!

@snowjewelz: So I'm no trans expert, but this is what my understanding is. Being trans is like being gay - you feel that way your whole life, but you may not be "out" until later. While people are not out, they general stick to their biological gender norms (i.e. Caitlyn Jenner dressing as a male, using the mens' bathroom). After they are out, they tend to dress as the gender they associate themselves with and want to use the associated bathroom for that gender.

Imagine you suddenly decide you can't live a lie anymore and don't want to present as female any longer. So you cut your hair, you wear men's clothes clothes. You want to present as a male. Then you have to go to the bathroom in public - do you want to look like a man going into a woman's bathroom? Or would you rather go along with your perceived gender to the men's room?

@coopsmama: We have a restaurant that has combined bathrooms. One open area where everyone washes their hands together and individual stalls were anyone of any gender can go in. It is so much easier when you have a child of the opposite gender. It doesn't just benefit those who are transgendered. I wish all public restrooms would just go towards this model

@T.H.O.U.: The argument or fear that now a perverted (non-trans) man will be able to lie and say he identifies as a woman to get into the women's bathroom and ogle people doesn't make sense to me. If there is a man who truly identifies as a woman and wants to use the women's bathroom, he (actually she but to make it easier to differentiate I'll use he) will no doubt want to be discreet - get in, do his business in the stall, get out. If there's a man who is pretending to identify as a woman coming in to ogle people it will be fairly obvious, because how easy is it really to ogle women using a bathroom stall? Is this person going to be standing on the toilet peering over the stall door at people? If so, that person will be reported, regardless of whether they are male, female, or trans. No one exhibiting that type of behavior is going to "get off scot free" no matter which sex they are, which sex they identify with, or whether they're trans or not. A woman ogling another woman in a bathroom would get reported, as would a man ogling another man. If someone is engaging in inappropriate or illegal behavior such as voyeurism or forced touching, saying that identify with the opposite sex isn't going to do anything for them.

I really think that's not a valid concern and it doesn't hold a lot of water in terms of arguing against gender inclusive bathrooms.

1. I thought the bulk of the people now calling to boycott Target over this issue were already boycotting Target because of the removal of gender identifiers on the toy aisles. Remember the debacle last year? Always have to complain about something.
2. What bathrooms do people think trans people have been using all this time? Newsflash – you’ve most likely been in a bathroom with someone trans before. And you survived the experience.
3. Bathrooms have stalls with locking doors. At least women’s bathrooms do.
4. This is not a “free pass” for anyone to do anything. That is the part that I hear argued that really annoys me. If someone peeps at you peeing, that’s still against the law. If someone assaults you or tries to, that’s still against the law. There is no get out of jail free card here.

What pisses me off the most is this completely disingenuous argument that MS and NC just want to protect their poor innocent women and children. Why don’t MS and NC fully fund testing the thousands of rape kits they have backlogged then? Why don’t they better and fully fund victim services, victim advocates, etc.? Because they don’t actually care about protecting women and children. They are uncomfortable with trans (and gay) people, who are far less likely to rape all the women and children than the straight males who are doing it now.

@Truth Bombs: Exactly!!! Like where are all these public bathrooms where people are hanging out in a common space where their parts on display??? Because I've never been to one!!

Transgender people literally just want to use the bathroom where they will be harassed the least. They would never walk into a bathroom where they were not like (in physical appearance) the majority of the people inside. Trans individuals are beaten and killed all the time, and instead of worrying about how to prevent that from happening, people are concerned that all of a sudden people will decide it's so easy to become a child molester now that they're allowed in the bathroom? It is totally baffling to me.

@Truth Bombs: Yes, its baffling to me to hear so many people argue like this legalizes criminal behavior. Wut?

Single or combined gender-neutral bathrooms makes the most sense to me in public. It makes things so much easier. I always get stuck taking DD into the bathroom with me when boh DH and I are out. I'd much rather a family or gender-neutral bathroom!

I think trying to police bathrooms is a waste of time, personally, and Im usually somewhat socially conservative. There's a long history of trying to police bathrooms, particularly the public ones in Ireland before homosexuality was decriminalized. It's messy and tedious and doesn't usually end well. I wouldn't recommend getting into that business, based on what I know about other times it's happened.

But I do think that just like anywhere else in a store, if you feel threatened or someone's behavior towards you makes you feel uncomfortable, you should be able to go to management or security and report it. Not report someone for peeing, but if they're making passes at you, regardless of gender? Sure. That's just common sense.

@snowjewelz: for real. Let me live in my own little bubble, please and thanks.

@Jess1483: not surprising. AT ALL. Seems like the ones most keen on the private part policing of others need to police themselves first.

@Truth Bombs: I agree!