Sleeping through the night after CIO

By LilacWine Oct 24, 2015

Oh sleep training. Can't wait until I'm on the other side of you...

Hoping someone has experience or wisdom to offer next steps here.

My second kid is just about 9 months old. We did CIO at 6.5 months for falling asleep at nap and bedtime. It worked and he has put himself to sleep ever since. After two weeks of CIO he still couldn't sleep all night without crying for over 25 minutes several times. I intervened again, as I did pre-sleep training, so as not to disturb my 2.5 year old and to get some actual sleep. Then, waking at 3am and 5am became 2am and 5am, etc. where now he's unpredictable again. So he wakes 2-3x/night and I nurse him back to sleep, again. Crying for 5-10 minutes seems to only rouse him more and then he's wide awake for at least an hour. Nursing seems to be quick and cause less interruption for everyone. However, I'm so over it.

How do you get a kid to sleep through the night when they can already put themselves to sleep?! With my first, CIO and night weaning happened at the same time. She was textbook CIO. Now, I'm at a loss for how to proceed and hope someone can offer ideas.

We did try CIO again at 7.5 months for this problem, but quit after the first night of 1 hour of crying with checks.

Any info is appreciated!

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24 comments

gingerbebe
cantaloupe / 6131 posts

Oct 24, 2015

Well at 9-10 months there seems to commonly be a regression and all the moms in my birth month club were having multiple night wakings and hysterical crying babies at that time. This was true of the babes regardless if they were sleep trained or not. We also had nap regressions and early waking around 10-11 months. So it could be a bad time to try CIO. My son STTN except for these odd phases. I might just try and wait it out a few weeks and then just go full bore on the CIO.
gracecat
clementine / 878 posts

Oct 24, 2015

True, it is hard to know if it's the CIO not working or it's a sleep regression. I had great results with CIO but when she had a regression I was so scared that she would never sleep through again. The longest sleep regression we had lasted 1 full month. So it might be worth just waiting it out, doing what you need to survive and try again in a couple of weeks. And I'm guessing you ruled out teething or any other medical issues, daytime sleep, or food issues by now.

For us, DD started sleeping again for no apparent reason after 1 month of newborn style waking up every 1-2 hours all night. I hope that it's just a temporary thing for you too!
MrsSRS
nectarine / 2987 posts

Oct 24, 2015

Nor sure if this would work for you, but with DS we switched night feeds to bottles from my stash and slowly decreased the volume over time. Or you can nurse fewer minutes each time?
gotkimchi
nectarine / 2400 posts

Oct 24, 2015

We had the worst time sttn! We did cio to fall asleep but my lo was still getting up just like yours like 2 or 3 and 5. Sometimes 2,3:30,5 etc. it was torture and not sustainable. I thought it's a regression, she's still really hungry, I'll wait it out etc. while she must have been nearing a year old when my pediatrician told me I have to deal with it. So we did full extinction. It took probably 3 nights and she slept through. It was rough, one night she was up from 3-5 then slept until 7. I didn't get any sleep these nights but it was necessary. I work full time and I couldn't keep going, honestly I don't know how I did it as long as I did and I always wonder if it would have been easier to deal with when she was littler
winniebee
hostess / wonderful grape / 20803 posts

Oct 24, 2015

I'm not sure other than CIO. My 10.5 mo still wakes up to eat around 3 and I just nurse him because I can't deal with 30+ mins of crying at that hour. My first sttn at this point so this is foreign. I'm hoping that he decides to sttn once we wean in a few mos.
SleepyMonkey
grapefruit / 4006 posts

Oct 24, 2015

So we have almost the exact same situation as you. Dd2 is 9 months, puts herself to sleep but still wakes up motn. Once, usually twice, sometimes 3x. CIO does not work, we tried for 2 weeks and she cried for an hour or more for most of the nights during that period. No progress. We threw in the towel and started just nursing for motn wake ups. I asked the pedi about it and she said we have to cut out the night feeds because there is no nutritional reason to do them at this age and because it's become a habit and that is why she is waking. We are trying that for the next few days or so. No idea if it is going to work. I feel so desperate for sleep. So. No good advice,just commiseration. Dd1 was also a textbook cio case....one night, 45 mins of crying then sttn after that. Dd2 is way more stubborn.
Silva
cantaloupe / 6017 posts

Oct 24, 2015

We started sending my husband in, which helped some. She didn't STTN until about a year after we sleep trained (at about age 1.5) so that she could fall asleep by herself. It just never worked for us for MOTN wake ups. She sleeps well now at night. but is an early riser and never a great napper- I think she has relatively low sleep needs like her dad.
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 24, 2015

thanks for the insight, everyone!

@gingerbebe: @gracecat: perhaps waiting until he's past the 9 month marker would make CIO work for middle of the night. I'll always hold out hope we're like gracecat and he fixes himself randomly! Who are these lucky people that happens to??

@MrsSRS: Great ideas! I read about reducing the amount per side at night. He's a quick little nurser and is less than 5 minutes per side. Can they go shorter than that? Maybe some sort of bottle transition at night will make me less appealing...

@gotkimchi: Yes! It's so easy to fall back on all the reasons they might be waking, when it's likely just they haven't powered through that on their own. Full extinction, meaning no checks? So did she cry for 2 hours straight form 3-5 that particular night? Can't wait until I'm on the other side like you and wondering why I put up with it so long. So hard when it seems like the only way.

@winniebee: Weaning should do the trick, right? Fingers crossed! That could be us too.

@SleepyMonkey: Good luck! If you think of it, I'd be curious to know how it turns out for you. Maybe we can model our routine after what you do since it really does sound like the exact same thing. Ugh, these kids!

@Silva: Also a great idea to have the husband break up the association. Will work towards that too!
SleepyMonkey
grapefruit / 4006 posts

Oct 27, 2015

@LilacWine: no progress to report over here. She just wants to sleep with me at night. I cut out the nursing but she still wakes up. I have no idea what to do! CIO really is not working with this one Any progress on your end?
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 27, 2015

@SleepyMonkey: So weird that CIO could be textbook for our #1s but not work for #2. I don't get it!

Two nights ago I tried giving him his first formula to try and "get more full", if that's a real thing. He drank almost 1/2 oz and went to bed happy. Then he woke up 5 times that night, not even wanting to nurse, just sad! Guess he probably had a bad gas reaction or something, so that backfired.

Then last night we changed it up again. My husband put him to bed for the first time, then we decided to try CIO at his first 11:30 wakeup. He cried for 30 minutes with two checks, and was only more hysterical. So I went in to hold him and he just fell asleep. Then his second wakeup was at 3:45 and my husband went in after two minutes to hold him until he calmed down. He went back down drowsy and slept until 6:30. So, that was the first night without nursing and we're going to take the same approach tonight. Husband will ago in and hold him until he calms down, then deposit him back in the crib.

I have no idea if we're substituting one association for another, if he slept because he was overtired from crying, or if he'll find solace in not seeing me at night. It worked for a girlfriend of mine at 9 months, so figured it's worth a try.
SleepyMonkey
grapefruit / 4006 posts

Oct 27, 2015

@LilacWine: when I send dh in, she continues to cry hysterically. She only wants me. I wonder if I should have dh do it a few nights in a row. Last night I thought I would try patting her and rubbing her back when she cried, and that worked but as soon as I stepped away or took my hand away, she would start crying again. After an hour of that, I brought her into bed so that we could both fall asleep but then she was wide awake for an hour, crawling around and flinging herself backwards. So that didn't work either. I am at a loss here. Let me know how tonight goes with dh. I feel so desperate for sleep!
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@SleepyMonkey: dare I say I've made progress?

Night 1- 8 bed, 11:45 (30 minutes CIO fail), 3:45 (25 minutes holding while crying), 6:30 awake
Night 2- 8 bed, 3:15 (20 minutes holding), 5:30 awake
Night 3- 8 bed, 5 nurse and back to bed (still sleeping now at 7am)

This morning my husband tried to hold him at 5, but he was eating his own arm. So I fed him and then my husband put him back in his crib awake. Then he fell back to sleep.

I'm afraid to say there's been progress for fear of jinxing it, but the second night his first stretch was 7 hours. Then the third night (last night) his first stretch was 9 hours. Neither of those have happened before, so I'm going with progress. And I haven't nursed him overnight since Sunday (3 nights).

Any luck with you?
SleepyMonkey
grapefruit / 4006 posts

Oct 29, 2015

That's pretty good progress and hooray for no night nursing!! Well. I don't think we have made much progress. I have stopped nursing overnight as well but she won't stop crying unless I am there next to her. So when she wakes up, I bring her into bed and we fall asleep together. For the past few nights she has slept from 730 to 4/5 and then into bed and sleeps until around 645/7. So it's not terrible. But she cries a bit when she comes to bed because I won't nurse. And then she kind of is awake for a bit and talking and waving her hands for like 45 mins. However, what has happened in the past is that she keeps pushing back the time she wakes up in motn until it's like 11:30 when she wakes up and then she is pretty much in my bed the whole night and she is a thrashy sleeper so I don't get sleep. Then we try CIO again because there isn't anything else we can do and she pushes back to a 5am wake up and the cycle repeats! I just wish I had a better idea of when these motn wake ups would end. Right now I feel like I'm never ever going to sttn ever again. I hope your progress continues tonight!!!
Mrs.Someone
pomelo / 5228 posts

Oct 29, 2015

Some babies still need to eat at night until 1 or later. I've just accepted that my son still needs me and will sleep through when he's ready.
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@Mrs.Someone: Agree that some need to eat at night for longer. Some also like to just suck. Because of this, I've discovered a new way to comfort that seems to provide for my son's needs.

@SleepyMonkey: Oh yes, the wakeup-time shuffle that leads to arms-up CIO. Thanks for the well wishes. I hope your girl doesn't back up her wake time tonight.
SleepyMonkey
grapefruit / 4006 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@LilacWine: haha. Omg. I read your response "some also like to just suck" as "some also just suck" like your baby just sucks at being a good sleeper. Then I read it again, correctly! Haha. I also agree that my baby doesn't need to eat, she just likes the comfort of it and being on me.
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@SleepyMonkey: Haha, well the double meaning wasn't intentional but is certainly accurate at times
Mrs.Someone
pomelo / 5228 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@LilacWine: yep, agree that some kids just suck. But please don't tell me that CIO is comforting for baby. Do what you feel is right for your family though!
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@Mrs.Someone: Wow, a CIO debate-bait. How cliché. Also cliché is this answer: some kids it works wonders for and two nights of controlled crying pays off for all parties sleeping better. I'm only human and can't seem to keep my sh*t together all day after months and months of sleep deprivation. It wasn't right for my second kid, but my first handled it very well. She's also a happy and well-adjusted two year old.
Mrs.Someone
pomelo / 5228 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@LilacWine: sorry, I'm not saying it doesn't work, or that you shouldn't do it, I'm just saying that it's not comforting for baby. It's stressful for them. But if it helps keep your family sane, then it's the right thing for you.
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@Mrs.Someone: Agreed, it's awful. Sanity is always the goal though!
brownepiano
persimmon / 1467 posts

Oct 29, 2015

My kid didn't sleep through the night till 8 months even though he was putting himself to sleep at bed time and nap time. Checking on him didn't work, he'd just get more riled up. So one night we did cio with no checks. It took just over an hour but we've never had a problem since.
Mrs.Someone
pomelo / 5228 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@LilacWine: amen I hear wine for mama helps at least!
LilacWine
coffee bean / 36 posts

Oct 29, 2015

@Mrs.Someone: oh yes!

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Sleeping through the night after CIO

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