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I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. I have difficulty interacting with my mom too. What she says isn't hurtful in such a direct and insulting way, but does suggest that my mom doesn't really listen and is often trying to one-up me. One way I've tried to make the best out of time with her even though it can make me upset is to just pay very careful attention to the things that strain the relationship and identify ways I can not do that with my kids. Like if she does something accidentally hurtful that I may do without thinking I take note and think "that hurt but it it's okay because noticing it will make me a better mom" or if it's something I would never do I get a self esteem boost like "well I'm a better mom than that!" That's my defense mechanism anyway. No clue if it's healthy but it might help...

My relationship with my mother is complicated but not in the same way as yours, so idk how much you can take from my advice. But I made a decision a long time ago to protect my children from toxic relationships, and that absolutely includes their grandparents.

For me that means you earn the right to be in my life and my children's lives. It's not something that just gets to happen because we happen to be related. For me the relationship you describe would be a recipe for going very low contact or even no contact. If I had a friend or coworker treat me in a similar way I'd stop talking to them. But I will also acknowledge that I'm ruthless when it comes to relationships with people. My mother was an addict growing up and I basically was never able to heal until I went no contact with her. It taught me that I've been conditioned since birth to accept the abuse and manipulation that my mother doles out.

And to be perfectly honest I didn't grow up close to my grandparents and I don't feel like I really missed out on anything. It wasn't anything bad, we just grew up thousands of miles away so i only saw them once a year.

A couple places that have helped me deal are:
https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists
https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/

These two communities have given me a mental framework for dealing with the manipulation and abuse I grew up with.

I wish you the best of luck. This stuff is the absolute worst to deal with!

Sorry you're dealing with this. It's really tough. I have no advice as I'm going through an estrangement with my own mother after being close forever. In the last 5 years (she doesn't like DH for the most shallow reasons), our relationship has resorted to texting on special occasions. No advice, just relating. Hope someone here is able to give you what you seek.

@mrskansas: "I don't know how to maintain a positive relationship with her without being constantly upset, but I feel like I need to because of my daughter."

I want to speak to this part of your post.

You will do far more damage to your daughter by being in a relationship with someone who constantly derides you, disrespects you, and hurts you and she sees it or even just feels your pain and tension. Would you want her to have a relationship with your mother if she acted that way towards your daughter?

I have a long strained relationship with my parents and we have a highly orchestrated relationship when it comes to my children because I flat refuse to be disrespected in front of my kids. I told my folks I will shut it down if they cross the line. My husband has my back, he has personally asked them to stop their mistreatment of me, and it was even to the point where my brother told me I was being unreasonable because I had put up with their behavior my whole life, why was I trying to get my folks to change now?

The reason was and is because I will not let my sons watch me be taken advantage of, pushed over, walked over, criticized, and insulted because I never want them to think treating anyone, especially their mother, a family member, or a woman that way is in any way acceptable. And there's NO guarantee my folks won't extend the same BS to my kids.

We have short orchestrated visits where my kids have positive interactions with my folks and then we leave. I don't stay with them, I maintain their schedules and control over their activities, and what I say goes. I am laid back with my inlaws but not with my parents because they don't get that privilege. If my parents say mean things about me, one day they could say things like that to my kids and NOPE. Not happening.

I'm so sorry this is happening to you but yeah, for your daughters sake I would REALLY think hard about what is more positive in the long run for your family.

@mrskansas: Holy shit. I stopped reading after the belly rub on the anniversary of your loss due date. Are you kidding* me? I am so very sorry that happened to you, especially by your mom. My mom is similar so I understand.

First off, I am sorry for the insensitive comments from your mom!!!! Also, happy belated birthday!

Regarding the difficult relationship, mine is strained with my mom for other reasons and we are geographically separated, so take my suggestions with that in mind.

-Your mom may not realize how hurtful her comments are, so I would suggest telling her that she hurt your feelings. Be prepared for her to try to minimize or justify the things she said and stay focused on how what she said made you feel rather than on the content of the hurtful statements.
-Enforce some boundaries. That is, I would firmly but calmly engage in corrective action when she does something undesirable with/around DD. Again, be prepared for her to resist you and defend her actions and stay focused on the boundaries you have chosen.
-Accept that your mother may never give you the validation or approval that you desire and know that this has everything to do with her emotional deficiencies and nothing to do with your awesomeness.
-Lastly, don't be afraid of hurting DD by introducing some space between you and your mother. Doing so will model how to protect oneself from emotional harm and is a positive thing!

@arosebyany: My ILs are like this also. My DH doesn't have a college degree but makes a decent middle class living as a restaurant manager. He worked his way up from the bottom, is a VERY VERY hard worker, and I am extremely proud of what he has accomplished. I do have a college degree, but I stay home with our children because he earns more than I did. They think being a SAHM "isn't contributing to the household" (MIL always worked). They are constantly offering us money and asking "Are you guys ok? Are you sure?"- it drives me crazy! They also don't like the town we live in and they think we are "controlling" with our children since I don't let them eat junk all day and insist upon basic safety protocols (i.e. car seat safety and not riding around on tractors while holding a baby). They don't visit unless DH begs them.... So we stopped chasing them and went pretty low contact in comparison my my parents. It sucks for DH to have a limited relationship with them, but he feels much better emotionally now that he doesn't chase them around. If they wanted a relationship where they didn't treat us like children that would be great. They won't though- their loss.

@mrskansas: I'm so sorry for your mom's hurtful comments. I'm also very sorry for your loss, and for the anniversary of the due date being on your birthday. Sending lots of love to you in that regard.

As for your mom, so many people have given you great advice above. I also have a very toxic mom. While my childhood was different from yours, my mom did a number on my self esteem growing up. I was the only girl and took the brunt of a lot. I was constantly told how ugly I was or how my hair didn't look right styled a certain way. She always had to have control over me and my brothers. She's ruined every significant event in our lives, and it's heartbreaking.

You will find that 1. You'll either come to a point where you can't take it any longer and snap (this is what happened to me), or 2. Distance yourself to the point where the relationship dissolves, but she makes it feel as if it's your fault.

I wholeheartedly agree with @gingerbebe: regarding your daughter. I finally decided that I didn't want my sons seeing the way my mom treated me and think that it was ok to do the same to me. We had a big, blowup fight, and I cut her out of my life for 6 months. She tried to contact me several times throughout the 6 months, and I ignored her. She said a ton of really vile things during that time, but eventually came around and realized this was me putting my stake in the ground. I was setting boundaries, and she wasn't going to cross them again. If she did, I wouldn't tolerate it.

Only you can decide when you've had enough and when you're ready to stand up to her. I can say that while I was ready when we had our big fight, I wasn't before that. And my brothers weren't ready to stand up to her at the same time. Everyone has to go through this at their own pace. Therapy has really helped me through how to handle situations in which she tries to manipulate me. If you can, I'd recommend you seeing someone to talk it through. I'm not great on my feet, and my therapist has given me solid tools to come back with if my mom tries to manipulate me on the spot now. I also say that our relationship is now on my terms, not hers. I decide when we talk. I decide when we see each other. If she crosses the line, we leave. End of story.

This is a very long winded way of saying, I hope that you find the strength to set some boundaries with your mom. It's the hardest thing I've ever done in my life, but my life is so much better because of it. If you need to talk at all, please PM me!

Honestly, I have not seen or spoken to my Dad in over a year. He grabbed me and yelled at me in public at a nice restaurant on Mothers Day in front off my daughter. Nope! My daughter should never see her Mother be treated this way.

I see a therapist once a month and I'm coming up on 3 years. It's been the best investment of my time/money ever. I trust her and she helps guide me and reassure me on setting boundaries with my family. I make the rules.

@gingerbebe: @azjax: @2PeasinaPod: brilliant advice, ladies

@newlypregnantlady: Thank you for those links

@mrskansas: Browsing through the links above, I found this to be very insightful.

https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/51j7zm/i_made_a_cheat_sheet_from_the_famous_options_you/

@mrskansas: I want to stress again that you have to be ready to be able to stand up to your mom. I understand being intimidated by her. I was also intimidated by my mom, and I was AWFUL at thinking on my feet. She was very good at twisting every conversation into her being the victim and me "attacking" her unnecessarily. My brothers and husband used to tell me to just stand up to her. It's not always that easy, and sometimes you can't do it until you're ready to do it. It had been ingrained in my being for 35 years that she was my mother and I couldn't disrespect her or cross her in any way or I'd pay consequences of tearing my family apart and being the only outsider. It was only when I was able to realize that wasn't the case that I could finally speak my mind and feel like I was in control of the situation.

Something my therapist taught me to do was to repeat your wishes in response to anything she says. For example, if she tells you how uneducated you are again, your response could be, "That's a really hurtful thing to say, and I won't tolerate you saying it in front of my child again." If she says something in protest...even if it's something along the lines of her only pointing out the obvious or her just joking with you, you repeat that phrase, "It's still a very hurtful thing to say, and I don't want you treating me that way in front of my child. If you do it again, we'll limit visits with you." If she gets angry, sad, plays the victim, anything, you continue to repeat your message, even if it's slightly different wording. It helps her understand your position on the situation will not change and you will not budge on your boundary.

@2PeasinaPod: To add on to what you said--which is great advice, imo--after the first time, it gets easier to find your voice and to stand up for yourself. My only regret was not doing it sooner. It took me becoming a parent to find my voice--because now it had the ability to impact my children, and there was no f*cking way I was going to let that happen.

My add-on would be that some people will never understand/accept you not allowing them to behave in a disrespectful/dismissive manner--they're just aren't capable of that level of empathy. I no longer expect my mom to understand why I won't allow her to say/do whatever she wants. And that is exactly why boundaries are so important.

@mrskansas: You are not crazy. I wish simply by typing this that you would truly believe it and accept it without question. It took me talking to a therapist (sorting out the issues surrounding the PPA I experienced with my first, some of which involved my mom) for me to learn and accept that it really wasn't me--that I wasn't crazy, that I wasn't sensitive/spoiled/ungrateful/think I'm better than everyone, etc., and that what happened to me wasn't normal (and that a lot of it was abusive). It's so hard to see your mom/parent in this light. The recommended reading above (Will I Ever Be Good Enough--Brene Brown is also another good reference) was really helpful for me. So many hugs to you!