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@MsLipGloss: Agree with you.
I think when it comes to finances you also have to look at how big of an impact it's going to have. If it's just you'll have to cut back on some luxuries (eating out, trips to the mall, etc.), then it may be worth it. If it's going to cause a lot of stress in your everyday life, though, then I don't think years of stress over money is worth a couple of big family get togethers a year. I know people often say, "oh it's only 4 or 5 years of hardship that's not much in the grand scheme of things." Uhhh....5 years is a hella long time!! My LO is only 10 months old and it feels like I've been sleep-deprived for an eternity.
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@JoJoGirl: I am glad to know you had a wonderful weekend!
There is no such thing as too sappy!
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@MsLipGloss:
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@MsLipGloss: I see exactly what you are saying but I guess I see JoJo's as well. Looking at our family in 20 years, what do I see, just DH, R and I laughing and having fun or do I see another child. I see another in our future, but I am not sure at what expense it is worth it.
I totally agree that having another child so your child has a playmate is not a reason to have a kid. Growing up my sister, brother and I played a lot together. But as we got older, not at all. We are close today but not super close. They will never be the first people I call if something happens. Family is family but that doesn't make them friends.@lawbee11: I agree! 5 years is a long time to pinch pennies. And I am not sure it is worth it.
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@lawbee11: 5 years is an eternity . . . especially if things aren't going well/you are overly stressed, etc. People want to brush it off/minimize it as if it's some inconsequential annoyance . . . the hell it is! That *inconsequential annoyance* is a pebble in my pond that will set off a chain reaction of events, over many of which I will have little--if any--control. My life could be drastically different--for better or for worse--in 5 years. If I am lucky, it will largely resemble what it does currently . . . but that is certainly no guarantee.
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@lawbee11: @MsLipGloss: in my defense, since I mentioned the early years being small in relation to the rest of the time, to *me* it *will* be just a small amount of time. I can respect that it might not be to others, but to some, it may be..isn't a one-fits-all scenario
she was just asking for both sides, so I offered my side. 
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@MsLipGloss: Totally agree -especially since kids pick up on stress, financial or otherwise.. it's not inconsequential.
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@Smurfette: Both equally valid sides of the same decision coin to be sure!
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@MsLipGloss: +1 to everything you said.
The stress of five years of penny-pinching can have significant effects on a child's quality of life, as well as on a marriage (and the example that marriage sets for your child(ren)).
When I originally posted I didn't weigh in with my experience as a (mostly - it's complicated) only child. It's been wonderful. And yeah, I know that when my mother dies I will be the only one there to deal with it, but I just don't think that's entirely true: I have DH, and I have DD, and I also have an incredibly strong and close-knit network of friends (which, incidentally, is something that only children excel at creating for themselves, according to the research I've read). I will not be alone. Nor have I ever longed for a sibling.
I'm in no way saying that having one child is the way for @Smurfette:, or anyone else, to go necessarily. But I do think it's important to dispel all the stereotypes and imaginings that are out there about the only-child family vs. the larger family.
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@sorrycharlie: Definitely not a one-size-fits-all decision! Generally, I think people significantly underestimate the stress that any major change in family dynamic can put on a family's foundation . . . I also think that people are not inclined to be forthcoming with that information because they are afraid of what people will think . . . I don't know anyone who will readily admit that they/their family was better off (happier, more stable./secure) before they had their second/third/x-number child.
That's why I am chiming in . . . because I think the argument *for* always gets so much more support and (positive!) *publicity* than the alternative argument.
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@sorrycharlie: Oh I meant more from a financial perspective (since the daycare expense is the main hangup here). I interpreted your comment to mean it's a short time in the grand scheme of things in relation to how difficult the newborn/toddler stage is. But financial stress really wears on you and 4-5 years of stressing over money is a long, long time. 5 years ago I hadn't even met DH or started law school.
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@sorrycharlie: I just can't get behind the statement "small in relation to the rest of the time" . . . because facts/circumstances don't happen in a vacuum, and you can't isolate out certain events/occurrences such that they would have not bearing on any other aspect of your life (, i.e., that it would *only* be hard on your finances for a few years . . . that ignores the stress/strain that limitation would have on your daily life, your marriage, your happiness, your family's happiness, other decisions you may make career-wise that would attempt to alleviate that burden that would inherently change your family dynamic, etc.) . . . the interconnection between the events influence and mold everything else (including your perception of them) . . . So there is no such thing as small. At least not in this sense.
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@MsLipGloss: we will have to agree to disagree
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Couldn't agree with @MsLipGloss: more that even a "short" time frame doesn't occur in a vaccuum and having to make severe adjustments to be able to financially or emotionally get through the first few years of a child's life can have very lasting effects.
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@Smurfette: So you mentioned 90% of the reason for being one and done is financial reasons, right? I hate that daycare is so expensive, but nothing you can really do about that if you cannot find a cheaper daycare that you love equally as well. We will have the same struggles with 2 in daycare as well, so I thought I would provide my thoughts on the financial aspect. The way I look at it- my LO will be about 2.5-3 years old when (hopefully) we have a second child. So until M is 5 and is able to go to kindergarten for free, things will be tight for about 2-2.5 years when both LO's are in daycare/preschool. I am probably going to go down to part time (would you be able/want to do this at your job?) to cut down on daycare costs, but also allows me to work and get out of the house a bit.
I am not going to lie, things are going to be extremely tight when we have a second child during the daycare years, but to me, having another child is more important than going on vacations, buying new clothes and things, etc.- but that is just how we feel personally. I have always envisioned having more than one child and I personally cannot imagine stopping at one for financial reasons-only because I do think in the grand scheme of things and looking ahead to our future, I see exactly what @@JoJoGirl described. I think you and your DH should sit down, go over your expenses/budget...is there room anywhere to cut? Maybe your DH will get a big raise? Is there a potential for a raise for you in the future?
I am not trying to sway you to have more than 1, that is something only you and your DH can decide- I just wanted to provide my thoughts on the financial aspect since you said that was 90% of your reasoning for being one and done.
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@sorrycharlie: I agree with you. But I also think having two won't put us into any REAL financial/emotional stress. Yes, we'll have to be more budget-conscientious, but I imagine it won't significantly impact our way of life or our marriage!
Also, to me, the long-term regret of not having two would far outweigh the burdens of two short-term. BUT I also don't have to pay $2800 in daycare costs (ours will be closer to $2000 for two and it will get cheaper as they get older). And financially, I feel like we will be able to afford two - it will just be harder than one, but not significantly so (hopefully...).
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@lawbee11: @MsLipGloss: @MamaMoose: last comment then heading out, don't want to keep threadjacking! though, it's kind of relevant, I guess? trust me when I say that I know financial stress. we have been under serious financial stress for the last five or so years. can we pay our bills? yes. do I wish that money was available for other things? yes. would it be smarter to not have a second? possibly.
but to *me*, to *us*, we are willing to put off being able to save aggressively, own a home, etc. for a few more years because we want a second child. that may not be for everyone, but it is the right choice for us. my saying that the first couple years of financial stress is small in the grand scheme of things (where I won't be working, we will continue renting, and won't be able to save as much as some people on HB do) is small, to us.
eventually, we will have more savings, eventually we will own a home. but that isn't priority for us. we have savings, we have a budget, we're making it work and we are happy. like I said before, one decision does not fit all
I just don't like when people assume I don't know what I'm talking about, that's all! just defending myself
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@NovBaby1112: I agree..I think it's a total personal decision! things one person might worry about, another might not.. and vice versa!
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I really wish some of the moms with older children would chime in on the costs of raising children and how they've been impacted. I personally don't think raising children is going to get any cheaper when my son is able to go to public school in a year, as we'll potentially have to deal with before and after care, plus summer camp. Not to mention the cost of activities and gear potentially increasing in price. Just because you don't have daycare doesn't mean you don't have expenses any more.
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@looch: I can already see how it can be costly with older kids with the ones I nanny - though, they're in optional activities - dance, gymnastics, soccer, swim, etc. I almost died when I found out how much $$ those things cost. That said, I never had any desire to do stuff like that growing up (super shy). I think the prices can vary if your kids do or don't do those things, but if they do, they're definitely pricey.
in our case, even with those costs, I'll be working at that point so it'll work better..part of me looks forward to the day I can work again
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@NovBaby1112: I can't work part time. My job doesn't allow it. I honestly don't know where we would cut back on our budget. We both won't give up cable, eating out, we both want/need vacations/date nights. I won't get a raise other then 2-3% annually, which doesn't cover anything. I will be looking for a new job but I don't see my salary increasing. Moving just to find something closer to home.
We will sit down once we know his raise and talk seriously about it. Right now it is just something we are both thinking about. Not deciding either way.
@Adira: See I don't see how #2 couldn't affect your marriage. Having 2 is a whole different ball game. R is going to start staying up later as she gets older, so there goes the little time DH and I have together. We are already both already tired, so another one is going to make it worse. Will be harder to get a sitter and have QT time. Just thoughts in my head. -
@looch: I agree!! Even once she is in elementary school, we are still paying after school care. While I know it is cheaper, I am not sure how much cheaper it is.
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@looch: And that's one of the problems with the *short-term/temporary* argument . . . it's just too short-sited.
@sorrycharlie: I am sorry if I made you feel defensive! My only goal was to round out the considerations, so to speak. Please continue to share your insight/input . . . it is all valid! And something you may share may help the OP more than anything else. I didn't mean to stifle the exchange!
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@MsLipGloss: no no I'm not mad! I just feel sometimes like people see me as like, "oh - that sorrycharlie - broke, tried for a second, got one, now complains!" hahaha. I will ALWAYS worry about money - it's just my personality! but, we had to really weigh a million pros and cons. ultimately, we want another child, I just have super cold feet over it. I just don't want people thinking that I'm not considering the financial aspect..lord are we, no choice involved lol.
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@Adira: I think there are very few couples that can just have a second (or third or fourth) child and not experience any financial impact. Anytime someone has a child there are going to have to be financial sacrifices. So obviously that alone isn't enough reason to not have another. Just depends on how much you're willing to sacrifice. Some people have nothing left to sacrifice and that's when it starts to take its toll and can have a potentially negative impact.
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@looch: It's not something I think about too much, since I'm a teacher and will always have the same holidays/summers off. So I'll need some form of before/after school care since my hours are longer but that's it.
But, both my older sisters (5 kids between them) and my SIL (2 kids) say that even with activities, public school is cheaper. But I imagine that depends on the family, the region, how many activities, etc. My sister limits her kids to 1 music lesson and 1 sport per season and that's all. My SIL does almost every sport plus math lessons, music lessons, etc.
They both live in far out suburbs.
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@Smurfette: I just mean I don't think it will significantly impact our marriage. Sure, it'll impact it, but I don't think it will be so detrimental that we'll have any serious issues. And for us, a later bedtime wouldn't be that big of a deal. Once they're old enough to have a later bedtime, we'll definitely be at the point where we're all eating together as a family, which will give Hubs and I more quality time together AFTER the kids go to bed. Currently, we rush to feed Xander after daycare and then Hubs and I don't eat until after he goes down. Then we make and eat our own dinners. If we could eat together as a family, we'd have so much more free time after the kids go to bed, even if they did go to bed 30 minutes or 1 hour later than now.
I also have the added bonus of having every other Friday off and Hubs often has a decent amount of flexibility in his job when he doesn't have a release coming up, so we could easily have day dates if we wanted while the kids are at daycare or at school.
BUT I know it's a lot harder for you. Your husband is gone during the week, so you only see him on the weekends anyway and if those weekends happen to be rough and/or late-nights, then there goes any chance you have at quality time, whereas Hubs and I have the whole week and usually a few of those days will work out for us!
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@Smurfette: Totally agree. Impact on our marriage is one of the major "cons" in my mind to #2, considering we barely survived #1. It's going to be so much harder for either of us to have 'down time' without one parent being outnumbered. And right now our routine is completely dependent (like yours) on someone parenting alone - DH in the mornings, me in the evenings - so I have no clue how we will manage that with another.
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@sorrycharlie: You totally made me lol . . . And fwiw, I think very few people *don't* stress about money . . . it's certainly not the only-- or even the most important--consideration.
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@lawbee11: Yes, I agree. It's hard for me to relate because while Hubs and I definitely WILL feel it financially, it definitely isn't going to be nearly as bad for us as for other people. I recently just got a promotion and a nice raise and my husband got a good raise and just right there between the two of us, we have almost the extra money needed to cover the cost of daycare for a second. We will still have to budget more and be more aware of our finances once #2 is here than we have had to, but it won't be THAT bad for us. And I know that we're lucky.
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@Smurfette: If you are planning on staying in the area where you are now check out the public schools! Once my DS starts 1st grade they provide before and after care and its $150 a MONTH!!!! So, yeah that's where he will be instead of at the private DCP that offers before and after care.
Depending on what sports they do will determine the cost. Hockey is $$$$
T-Ball - $100 for the season
Dance - YMCA was $75 for 8 weeks
Competitive dance - $$$$With a 3 and 5 year in DCP old I am paying $2000 a month and I don't care what activities they do when they get older but I can promise you it wont cost me $2000 a month!
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Even if the pros and cons look the same for multiple people, the underlying ability to handle the decision and lifestyle changes (be it tightening that budget or letting go of the imagine of the family you pictured) of individuals and the different dynamics of every situation means there will never be a clear cut "best" option for anyone.
I guess my only real addition is for you to think if you did decide to go for LO#2 and had a lot financial struggle those daycare years and beyond, would you regret it? Do you think that it could break apart what you already have?
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@sorrycharlie: Definitely didn't mean to imply that one decision fits all. I get that some couples are willing to sacrifice more than others. I just feel like a lot of people on HB talk about how it's only a short period of time in the grand scheme of things so was just trying to offer a different perspective as the OP and I are a lot alike in what we are and are not willing to sacrifice.
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@lawbee11: I mean we have to keep our girls in the latest BG
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@Smurfette: I was referring more to this statement: "We both won't give up cable, eating out, we both want/need vacations/date nights." But yeah, add BG to the list
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I really appreciate you HB ladies and your thoughtfulness on the topic. I've been thinking a lot about this lately.
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@lawbee11: I know!
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I feel like if in your heart you know you want two then you should go for it. Sometimes in life you make decisions that maybe aren't the most logical but have added value that can't be monitized. I bet a lot of HB would think that in my case having kids at this point is not the most financially sound decision but to us it is beyond worth those sacrifices. I would also add that having two hasn't been twice as hard as one and in many cases it has even been easier since we've already made the adjustment to a more child oriented lifestyle.
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I wish to chime in but I don't have much of value for this particular situation! I always pictured having two or more, but now that I have two, I am in fact faced with a similar decision (do I WANT another? maybe. can I AFFORD another? nope, not right now at least). I've thought about it ever since my second was born, and I've come to the conclusion that after my first was born, I still felt anxious and immature. After my second, I feel happy and complete, even though I have a lot more anxiety-causing issues being a mom of two! I can't explain why, other than that I just feel secure now that my family is complete. So even though the decision over whether to have a third or not seems to be largely financial, it really does boil down to how I feel about myself and my family.
Also, I am a big believer in working hard at the current moment so that, in the future, you never look back and regret not doing something... which is why we went ahead and had #2 even though we technically couldn't afford it. Wagon Sr. and I have always been able to work our butts off to make enough to get by (we've already caught up and our financial health is even better than before we had kids!), so I didn't want to look back when I'm 60 and rich (hah!) and regret not having more children. Too late to change anything about it then...!! Except maybe get more dogs.
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@Baby Boy Mom: I think that makes sense. if you know you want 2, you prioritize it. We know we want two so it's not an issue for us. We'll make it happen and I would prefer to have a second child over more "stuff". We're in an income level that we can definitely afford two, but it will mean less clothes shopping, no fancy gifts, maybe fewer vacations and not having top-of-the-line everything. For me personally, it's a no brainer. I know when I'm 80, I'm not going to wish I'd had better pots and pans in my 30's.
But I imagine if someone is on the fence and not knowing if they even want 2, or if they are in a tighter financial situation, it probably makes the decision harder.
There is no such thing as too sappy!
she was just asking for both sides, so I offered my side. 
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