I haven't heard much in terms of effectiveness and arguments FOR spanking, but it seems to be something people are still doing.
Are there positives?
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M is 14.5 months and I have given her a light spank on the hands when she does something that is dangerous. This is after I tell her to stop and she doesn't listen.
Case in point: we have a floor fan in the family room and she likes to play with it with her little hands near the fan portion. I tell her to stop playing with it. She does not listen. I come over and tell her to stop again. She does not listen. I give her a light spank on the hands. She either dramatically flails on the ground "crying" OR runs away laughing.
Sigh. Toddlers.
But that is the extent of "spanking" I am comfortable with doing. Only a light tap when she is doing something dangerous.
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For some things, I feel a child needs to be abruptly taught that what they are doing is wrong. For example: if a child goes near a hot oven and will not listen when you tell them no, you may need to instill some quick importance. It doesnt have to be anything violent but a reminder. There is obviously doing it too much and resorting to spanking over every little command, which becomes a negative response. I firmly believe in acknowledging good behavious before punishing bad ones.
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We spanked DS twice when he was 3 (well DH did). First time, we were getting into the car and DS ran out into the street (DH thought he was with me and vise versa when we were getting ready to go). The second time was on a trail where I took DS with his bike, I was 8 months pregnant and he ran from me + his bike. I could barely chase after him but luckily DH picked us up minutes later.
Anyway, we don't like to spank. I certainly never thought I would but when the time came and words were not working - that's what we resorted to. I hope to never spank again.
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Spanking was used as a discipline tool when I was growing up. It was only brought out for extremely bad behavior. I'm OK with parents using it judiciously and plan to use it sometimes with my own kids, but it should not be the only method of discipline.
Eta: I don't think many people see a positive side to it. Because it may not work to curb every child's behavior problems.
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I think parents who do spank are sometimes reluctant to discuss (or rather, *defend*) their decision due to spanking not being p.c.
I have not made a decision regarding spanking.
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@Lindsay05: I agree!
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Thank you for starting this thread. My husband and I have opposing views on this topic and in fact had a theoretical -- we don't have a child yet -- argument about it yesterday.
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Spanking means something different to people.
An attention grabbing swat on the behind or hand to stop immediate danger is not a spanking IMO.
To me, spanking is a form of punishment, meted out after a discussion on why the behavior was undesireable. The parent is calm. The child lays across the bed or kneels and either a hand or belt is used once or a few times to strike the behind.
I think a beating is using any object that is handy and striking any part of the body. Both the child and parent are upset. The beating takes place in the heat of the moment. Wether the beating is out of control or not depends on the parent, but to me this isn't very constructive.
Idk, what I will do as a parent. Spanking shows the kids you mean business. A parent must be so frustrsted, disappointed, or pissed at their child to inflict physical pain. I imagine my child will push me to my limits where I want to hit or shake or pinch them, but there has to be a better way to channel that energy so the child learns to do better the next time.
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I was just going to ask this question!!! Why are people so passionate about spanking? My motives are not totally pure in this case. I am genuinely curious, but the reason is that I want to better be able to counsel patients and families and have answers to their objections to my recommendations.
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: hmmm very good point. In your description I am not OK with that level of spanking.
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@Mrs. Jacks: do parents really ask their pediatrician these types of questions?
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I was spanked often as a child as a regular part of discipline, which was pretty normal at the time. I think hitting was resorted to a little too frequently with me, but I'm not totally against it as a form of discipline for my future LO's. When other punishments just won't work and the wrongdoing is bad enough (like intentionally running from parents in public, etc.) then the punishment needs to be pretty severe. It's tricky though, because you don't want to teach your kids violence so I think it should only be used in extreme situations, but yes - sometimes it's necessary.
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@regberadaisy: all. The. Time!
But, I also have seen parents swat their child in front of me and it's always tricky to have that conversation on the fly. I do love this community for giving me so much sage background understanding of various behaviors and think that my time here makes me a better doc.
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: After reading your post, I will say taht I would never really want to inflict actual pain on the child. It's more about getting the child's attention and having a chance to show how disappointed you are in their actions. Because that's always teh goal with any punishment, but sometimes nothing else gets the message through. And I've heard you should never spank when angry - but I find that almost impossible advice to follow especially for people like me who want to only use it in extreme circumstances, I'd imagine I'd be pretty angry at that point, even if we waited until some time had passed.
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@Mrs. Jacks: interesting. I love our pediatrician but I would never ask him for advice on how to raise my child. I feel that's between my husband and I! All different kinds of people in this world!
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@regberadaisy: I'm the same way. It would never occur to be to ask the pediatrician this. But I have friends that would not make a parenting decision without consulting the pediatrician first. *shrug*
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@Modern Daisy: Well swats, spankings, and beatings do hurt. A time out and taking away toys or other priveleges "hurt" too, but spanking is painful. Not saying spanking is bad in every situation, but let's be real a hit hurts.
I have seen parents give a stern look or use a tone that can startkle a child to immediately stop unsavory behavior and even make their children cry.
My brother got spanked or beat (very wimpy because my dad coukd never catch him ha ha), but his behavior didn't change an ounce. DH swears by the spankings and other physically uncomfortable and painful punishment he received as a child. He said as he got older it didn't hurt. But, seeing when his mom disapproved of his behavior let him know his limits outside of the house. He acted up with her, but was good elsewhere.
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@regberadaisy: @Weagle: I agree. I would never consider asking my Ped questions about discipline.
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: I agree that spanking definitely means different things to different people. I'm not really comfortable with either of the scenarios you described.
I was spanked (that I can remember) exactly once. I had lied to my teacher and my parents. My dad was really torn up about it and I could tell he didn't want to spank me. I remember feeling so ashamed of myself for disappointing my dad and that's what made the "don't lie" lesson serious - not because he hit me.
I feel like if I ever spanked my child it would come from anger, not as a way to teach a lesson, and that's never good.
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@mewtill: How did he do it?
I can recall one spanking. I was about 3 or 4. I dyed our beige carpet using b my mom's henna and vaseline and hair spray. It was a small spot of carpet in the first bedroom. I want soaked right away. My dad spanked me, while my mom watched.
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: I was about 7 or 8. It was like you described: he sat me down, told me he knew the real story, and was very clear that he was disappointed/upset because I had lied & not because of what I had decided to lie about (using naughty words). He talked about lying being disrespectful, etc and then said he was going to spank me. I remember being like "What? I get it, can't we move on?" He used a belt and I cried and I remember my mom telling me it at least he didn't make me go get a wooden spoon or something. Also, he was nearly crying when he sent me to my room.
At first I felt like it wasn't fair for him to be upset because HE hit ME, but I realized pretty quickly why he was sad and then I felt super bad. And I still don't lie!
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: I also don't think a quick pop on the hand or rump with your hand when the child is in danger is a spanking.
The spanking/beating examples you gave are ones that I was raised experiencing. It's sometimes interesting to talk to my mom now as an adult about this because I don't agree with her methods and don't think spanking helped change my behavior. Well, I just hid things better from her. And I also learned to fear her and pretty much didn't like her. I can't remember how many times I was spanked/beaten but it was enough (plus I got to see my other siblings get it, too) for me to know that I will NEVER EVER do that to my children.
ETA: to answer the original question. I know that with my mom, she was a single parent and that's the way she was raised and she just didn't know any better.
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My personal opinion is that a swat on the butt or on the hand is a useful tool when used to get the childs attention quickly when in a potentially dangerous situation. I can't get behind the whole "conversation first, spanking second" thing. If you already have the conversation I don't feel that the spanking is necessary. I am also very against using anything other than the palm of your hand. I would NEVER use a spoon, belt, or anything else because you can't feel the force you are using as easily.
I was spanked as an attention grabbing tool when I was younger and I think it worked out pretty well. I respect the way my parents raised me and I hope I can be as good of a parent as they are.
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I was "spanked" but this was a quick swat on the bottom or hand when I was about to do something that I was supposed to that would be dangerous (or after the fact, like running away and hiding or running into the street)
I don't intend to use spanking as my only and go-to form of discipline but I am not opposed to it, on a rare occasion it is necessary (as it was when I was a child)
We got more lectures than anything!
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DH and I disagree a lot on spanking. I don't see any reason for spanking when there are other forms of discipline that can be used. He thinks it's necessary for younger kids when talking & communicating is harder. I just worry about us losing our temper and spanking out of anger which is not good.
The only times I remember being spanked as a kid was out of anger on my parents part. In first grade my teacher held the class late after school so I wasn't there when my dad pulled up to pick me up. He made me wait like half and hour and when he pulled up he pulled me into the car and spanked me a bunch. He was so angry that he had to wait for me. Probably drunk at the time who knows. My mom spanked me once when my brother and I stayed up late and we were jumping on the beds. This was after my parents were divorced. She got angry that we woke her up and she swatted me on the butt. I remember it hurting pretty bad. These childhood memories make me not want to use spanking.
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As many others have said, the reason we would spank is to establish with a child the severity of their disobedience if they don't fully understand natural consequences. I do think it is important to establish with kids that parents must be obeyed, period, for their own safety and well-being, but not all 3-year-olds can understand that. However, if they get spanked after they run in the street, and warned next time that they will get a spanking if they do it again, I feel like that could be the next best thing to logical consequences, which obviously are not applicable in that situation.
I think by the time your child is old enough that you can "have a talk" before spanking, there are other punishments that could work just as well, such as removing privileges.
Our goal is to use other parenting techniques than spanking, and we would never spank out of anger or exasperation, but we aren't against spanking in general so it's a tentative option.
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@ElbieKay: DH and I have had a similar argument. I'm anti spanking and he's pro. It devolved into a shouting match... I'm hopeful that the next conversation will be a little more civilized.
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I think I was spanked <5 times my entire life-- and it was a last resort for my mom each time. I had been given multiple warnings to not do something (lie, take money from her purse to buy candy, get bad grades [for not trying, not because I didn't know how], not doing what I was told, etc. and I disobeyed after other forms of punishment (time outs, being grounded/placed on restriction).
When I was spanked, my mom gave me a final lecture, had my lie on the bed, and would spank me calmly. It wasn't 100% effective, but it was a helluva lot more effective than any other disciplining method. This is how we plan on using spanking with our kids. And like others have said, I don't think anyone is all "HORRAY!" about spanking, but we just feel that it would work for our family.
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I have always wondered how any parent can choose to inflict physical harm on their children - it really baffles me.
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I am undecided on the issue but I am leaning towards no spanking or hitting.
I can say that I rememeber my parents swatted me on the hands a few times when I was near something hot or dangerous. They also had a flexible stick that they used very lightly on my bottom but only once or twice. I remember it being threatened (either by telling me it was going to happen or by shaking it so I could hear the sound) a few times when I was being very naughty. The sound was enough for me to shake in my boots.
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@Mrs. Lemon-Lime: I know it would hurt, even if only a little bit - I meant I would never want it to be a real 'beating' with foreign objects or really hard hitting. My parents had no issues doing that to me and I have a problem with leaving my child with a bloody nose or bruises.
@daniellemybelle: That is exactly how I feel. I think every child is different and some may never need to be spanked at all, but if nothing else is getting through and the behavior is bad enough, hitting/spanking is like a final means to really get their attention and show them who is boss. Again, it's tough because you don't want to teach them violence - but I think it is important for parents to show their kids who is actually in charge. Some get it easily, others need a stronger message.
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@MrsKoala: Yes, we are split the same way. From what he's described, it really sounds like his parents were borderline abusive, so I think it's strange that he still wants to reserve the right to use corporal punishment on his own children. I got upset because he was not engaging in a serious discussion about it and instead was taking a hardline view. I am only 8w4d pregnant so there is plenty of time to have a more rational discussion about it. I got pretty upset with him over his tone last time.
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@ElbieKay: Sounds remarkably similar. My DH's reasoning is that his mom spanked him and hit him with a spoon and he is fine. Yet, my parents spanked me once and I'm fine as well. I'm just not comfortable with someone touching my child in anger. He doesn't see it how I see it. Since I'm in the same boat as you in the first tri, I figure that I won't try to have that conversation again until baby is born. My hormones are running too high right now to have a rational conversation about it.
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I don't plan on spanking, but I am not opposed to a hand slap if she is going for something dangerous or is not listening repeatedly when it coudl cause harm to her or someone else. I will not be the parent that dicusses bad behavior than puts her over my knee to be spanked. I do not think this is effective at all (my paernts did this to us in extreme cases, I remember 3.)
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This is going to be a huge battle... DH and I were both spanked, quite a bit. Neither of us have any bad feelings about it, and I would say that it was an extremely successful form of punishment for me. However, as I've been thinking about it more and more now that I have a child, I think it did affect me in a slightly negative way... Whenever I sense anyone getting angry in any way, I immediately start crying. It's very annoying at work and at home with DH. By the end of my childhood, my Dad could simply give me a 'look' and I would melt down in tears. It resulted in me being an extremely well-behaved child and adult, but I am quite emotional when it comes to anger - not sure if it's 100% because of spanking, or if that's just how I was meant to be. It did NOT work for my sister at all - she would end up just taunting my Dad... haha. I don't want to hurt my child though - I have a lot of research and reading ahead of me, and I'd better do it soon - she's growing up toooo quick!
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