Hellobee Boards

@jennlin821: So, I don't think I have this problem, and I spend a lot of time trying to figure out why so I can communicate it to other people to see if it could help them. I haven't worked that out yet, so here are some random thoughts.

I think some of it is just my husband. He cares that our household runs, so he takes care of the things that are priorities to him. Largely this is: laundry, cooking dinner, and making sure things around the house get fixed. I deal with child care, breakfasts, purchasing anything that is needed in our household, picking up after people. For the most part, neither of us bug the other about their duties. Sometime the laundry I wish was clean is not clean - I do not nag, I move on. Sometimes I don't like dinner - I just suck it up and eat something else later. Sometimes I'm bugged that I'm usually the one that picks up toys, etc., but then I remember that he does the vast majority of other things, and I try to shut my mouth.

Neither of us want to clean, so we outsource that. It took us a while of living in filth to get to the cleaning service, though. I think I care more about the filth than he does, so I suggested a cleaning service. He was resistant because he doesn't like spending money. But when I just stopped doing
even the minimal amount I was doing, he got on board. And I think this might be key. Can you just stop doing some things that you know your partner cares about and wait for them to do it?

We really don't talk much about division of labor anymore, other than to occasionally ask for acknowledgement of our efforts, which we are both mostly happy to do.

@hitchhiker: in my mind i think emotional labor is different from the chores you have mentioned. I think most husbands do chores, but there's a lot more work to running a household that isn't phyiscal tasks like scheduling kids doctors appointments etc that can become overwhelming if only one person has to coordinate everthing

I think my husband and I also have a far more equitable division of chores and emotional labor than a lot of others we know personally and what I've read online through this and other articles. Some of it has to do with early division and management and setting expectations early. Some of it has to do with continued communication. A lot of it has to do with me learning early the lession of Let It Go.

That was both necessary for me personally as someone with diagnosed OCD/perfectionism with my own tasks/responsibilities/expectations/guilt as well as with my partner and what he is doing and is responsible for. It took a long time and I think I was especially lucky it was easy because he doesn't have the naturally defensive nature that so many people talk about when having these conversations.

I do still do more emotional labor for our family AND I am WOH while my husband works part time and is mostly SAH. It's partly because of what the author of this article mentions at the end - she doesn't want to not do these things, she just doesn't want to be the ONLY person to do it or care about it. I happen to really enjoy meal planning, grocery shopping, and cooking - so I do these things. I also have historically managed our finances because even if my DH was doing it I would ALSO be doing it and micromanging and it just makes sense for me to continue to be primary on this task.

I used to be the social calendar keeper and am somewhat still, but this has shifted a lot with family by setting expectations with THEM about who to communicate with. Is he your son/nephew/grandson? Then contact him about plans or expect HIM to send you a card or call or whatever. And with DH taking on a primary role for school he is now the person who handles responsibilities, deadlines, field trips, and play dates. When people talk to me about these things I sometimes handle them, but I more often tell them that I will let DH know and he will get back to them or take care of it or give them his number so they can make plans.

@hitchhiker: I think the author does address some of the whole "let it go" issue and the implications it still has for the woman. The examples of when we choose to let it go and then society/family/partners/ourselves still push the 'failure' and guilt onto us. Like the oral surgery/kid getting ready story. I was furious reading that. And I couldn't help but feel like the author did a perfectly acceptable job of prepping her husband for what needed to be done only for him to majorly drop the ball and her have no choice but to pick it up. I would have also second guessed myself and the prep that I did - but I also wouldn't get too far down that rabbit hole before realizing that no, this was not on me. That seems to be the biggest difference for those who can practice the freedom of 'let it go' and those for whom it's more of a challenge.
I also do a good bit more planning/management labor but DH does more chore/execution labor. It balances OK for us, and he is always very appreciative and acknowledges this which keeps me from being resentful.

I think we are pretty equal but DW thinks I do more, which might be true. I don’t have an issue saying to her ‘I need you to do this thing because it annoys me and I don’t want to deal with it’ but most of the other stuff I do majority of I’ve realized that I am actually a control freak about it so I’d rather me do it ha! So cooking, groceries, appointments, buying stuff is the main culprit for us but I’ve got less resentment because I’m good at doing those things and like to get them done when I want. DW does stuff I don’t want to do so I also think it’s picking strengths for each person. What about making a list together about things that need to be done to manage? We’ve done that before and it helps the other person see things from your perspective and then it can be split up.

@hitchhiker: I agree.

That said, it’s a VERY common phenomenon - to the extent that on my last firm wide retreat, several (like six) professional women were commiserating about having to write down a step by step list for their spouses on how to keep the kids alive.

@hitchhiker: No I totally agree with you!! It’s crazy. I was just saying, it is a widespread problem, and people are not fixing it - whether or not there is a solution - my colleagues at least aren’t finding it.

@hitchhiker: jumping in here- no one would die, but I think other people would suffer more than my husband would if he was poorly prepared- like teachers and other students suffer if he drops the kid off late, of your own kid suffers if he forgets to pack lunch or forgets an activity. So while I’m willing to let my husband suffer for his own incompetence, I am not willing to inconvenience other people or let my kids suffer for it (within reason).
Those are just generic examples- when I leave I need to remind my husband about activities and times but he is capable of deciding to make them Mac and cheese or tortellini on his own. He has learned the hard way that one of our kids won’t eat said tortellini if he dares put tomato sauce on it. Then again, I’ve never been gone more than overnight. And that was once since our almost 3 year old was born.

For us, I SAH, so of course much of those stuff falls on me- both scheduling doctor appts and getting to school on time and making lunches, but also bigger things like researching the right school for them and what activities would be best for them and things like that. This part I’m ok with as long as I get the acknowledgment and help when I need it. But smaller things like everyone on both sides of the family ask me what the kids want for Christmas and what WE want and I don’t get the feeling that he knows what’s another mental load. And yet, like the author, any time I’ve talked to another woman about it, she gets it immediately.

@Foodnerd81: I hear you on the point about letting your husband suffer for himself but not wanting him to inconvenience others. I don't know if you can relate to this, but I used to feel like when my husband forgot something and it screwed up schedule or messed up someone else's day that it was a reflection of our entire family. I've started looking at it more like, "okay, that's on you, not US". I'm far from having all this figured out, but the burden is lighter since I started thinking this way. Also, I got the idea for the above sentiment when I realized that's how he reasoned

@Foodnerd81: YES. my linen closet looks like a german army.

My husband does a lot more than other husbands I know, but that blows my mind because I still do more (regular labor and emotional labor) related to our kids, so I don’t understand how other husbands get away with doing even less.

I actually don’t love the term emotional labor lately because most of this stuff in the article is just actual labor. So folding a sheet, regular household task. Cooking meals and planning meals—regular task. Buying birthday gifts—also not emotional. Calling and making appointments—actual labor. Helping kids with homework or cleaning out closets because of seasonal changes, loading a dishwasher correctly, doing laundry correctly, packing backpacks and getting the kid and all their fbead to school—it’s all regular labor.

The emotional labor—remembering events, rsvp-ing for events, I guess this is emotional labor, but we also have “remembering when the car needs an oil change, remembering when bills are due, remembering to make a payment for Dance,” and in our house, these things are split pretty evenly. My husband never thinks about regular dentist and doctor checkups and I do. But he remembers his own family’s events and pays the big bills and remembers when bills are due and when we have payments to make. Before we got married, I would pay late fees all the time because I would just forget to pay on time—now, everything is in time because it’s either set up to auto pay, or my husband remembers. I remember kid classmate birthdays/gifts/doctor appointments. I think that’s a fair split.

My husband is 100% in charge of breakfast daily, from shopping for the items to knowing what’s in the fridge, to preparing it and cleaning it. I do dinner and I pack lunches at the same time. So I do 2 kid meals while he does 1, but I work 1 hour less a day than he does so I don’t think it’s an unfair split.

Our one big issue is house cleanliness—I am actually not a clean freak and I don’t care how a fitted sheet is folded. But I don’t like the main area of our house to be messy and I think everything should be cleaned 1x a week, and my husband just like Doesn’t think bathrooms ever need to be cleaned. I’m not goin to clean a grown mans barhroom, so I stopped sharing a bathroom with him and now he has his own bathroom that is generally filthy and I share with our kids and our bathroom is generally clean.

Do I like that his shower has probably not been cleaned in 3 months? No. It’s an issue that comes up over and over—but I generally try to avoid it because I’ve realized he has a lot of things together (he’s great at laundry for instance) but he is somehow not capable or just doesn’t place importance on having a clean bathroom space. I have taught, I have nagged, I have asked, I have pleaded, I have ignored—and still the bathroom is dirty. So I give up.

I should say, he feels the same way about how I do laundry. I am the one that does laundry and put the clean load on a chair in our room and then I never put it away, it just sits there till I wear it. I think clean laundry is better than a dirty bathroom. But at the end of the day, we both have 1 big issue that drives the other person crazy and I try not to let it ruin our daily life.

Mail piling up in a common space for 3 months? Man that’s terrible when it’s resulting in unpaid bills and Late fees and lower credit ratings. I guess I should be thanking the universe my husband place big importance on doing things that would cost him money—I may have a dirty master bathroom but that’s one thing I will never have to worry about.

Humans are weird—it makes you wonder how much is nature vs nurture. My mother is the most organized person in the world but I didn’t inherit that from her. My husband is type A in so many ways, but that mysteriously leaves him when it comes to his bathroom. We all have our mysterious foibles.

Saw this this morning on the Scary Mommy Facebook page. Made me think of this thread, and is one of the better descriptions of my definition of emotional labor I have seen.

I am the keeper.

I am the keeper of schedules. Of practices, games, and lessons. Of projects, parties, and dinners. Of appointments and homework assignments.

I am the keeper of information. Who needs food 5 minutes before a meltdown occurs and who needs space when he gets angry. Whether there are clean clothes, whether bills are paid, and whether we are out of milk.

I am the keeper of solutions. Of bandaids and sewing kits and snacks in my purse. But also of emotional balms and metaphorical security blankets.

I am the keeper of preferences. Of likes and dislikes. Of nightly rituals and food aversions.

I am the keeper of reminders. To be kind, to pick up their trash, to do their dishes, to do their homework, to hold open doors and write thank you notes.

I am the keeper of rituals and memories. Of pumpkin patches and Easter egg hunts. I am the taker of pictures, the collector of special ornaments, and the writer of letters.

I am the keeper of emotional security. The repository of comfort, the navigator of bad moods, the holder of secrets and the soother of fears.

I am the keeper of the peace. The mediator of fights, the arbiter of disputes, the facilitator of language, the handler of differing personalities.

I am the keeper of worry. Theirs and my own.

I am the keeper of the good and the bad, the big and the small, the beautiful and the hard.

Most of the time, the weight of these things I keep resembles the upper elements on the periodic table - lighter than air, buoying me with a sense of purpose.

But sometimes the weight of the things I keep pulls me down below the surface until I am kicking and struggling to break the surface and gasp for breath.

Because these things I keep are constantly flickering in the back of my brain, waiting to be forgotten. They scatter my thoughts and keep me awake long past my bedtime.

Because all these things I keep are invisible, intangible. They go unnoticed and unacknowledged until they are missed. They are not graded or peer reviewed or ruled on by a court. And sometimes they are taken for granted.

My husband and my boys are kind and generous and they love me hard. And this is by far the greatest job I have ever had. But sometimes being the Keeper is exhausting. Because you feel like you're doing it alone.

So to all of you who are keepers, I see you.

I know the weight of the things you keep.

I know the invisible work you do, which doesn't come with a pay check or sick leave, is what makes the world go round.

I see you.

And I salute you.

#LoveHard
#ISeeYou

(via Lucky Orange Pants)

@Mrs. Turtle: yes this!!!

I've been reading along with this thread.

I am lucky to have a husband who does contribute quite a bit to the household chores. He does the dishes and he does his own laundry, he does the recycling and trash and other things like replacing the dryer when it died and getting me a new battery for my car. He cooks dinner often and he cleans up after himself. I feel pretty lucky on these issues..

However, I am the one that keeps our every day running smoothly. I really like what @Mrs. Turtle: just posted bc this is what I feel makes me tired and run down.. not necessarily the physical things like doing my laundry and the kids laundry, which I do, or bath nights, which I do, or making sure they have wardrobes and rsvp'ing to parties and taking them to parties and all the events at school etc... whats harder on me is the worry and the making sure they are getting the love, attention, growth, interaction, experiences that they need to be happy well rounded individuals. All while working 40 hrs a week, commuting 2 hrs a day and solo parenting most nights while DH is working late.

No wonder I sleep past my "wake up" time every day!!!

@Mrs. Turtle: That was fantastic! DH and I just had a conversation about that exact thing yesterday evening. I copied it and text it to him. He said it really highlighted what I had been discussing and he "gets it."
Thank you!

This is a topic that is on my mind very frequently. I am not as pissed about it as I used to be, but I think this is likely because me and Mr. Cereal are in a good place right now.

But here's the thing. Because I spend so much of my time making sure that everything is running smoothly, I am exhausted most of the time as well. I do nearly all of the coordinating of everything and he sits back and does what I ask him to do, but never takes the initiative to do any of this work himself. A great example of this is that I just finished all of our Christmas shopping, and I seriously mean all. This included gifts for all the members of his family, my family, our kids, and our friends. He bitches to me about the money I am spending, but doesn't acknowledge that I am taking care of this huge task that is annoying and time consuming.

And as far as nobody getting "hurt", I guess I can see where some people are coming from if we were to stop doing the emotional labor. But the truth is that my kids would be the ones that suffer. I make sure that they are dressed, on time, and responsive to invitations, etc. I make their appointments, I get them there, I attend all school related functions, I am the one that does all of this. If I were to stop, they would be late, they would miss appointments, etc. I won't manage my husbands life needs, but I can't just stop managing my kids life needs.

I just wish that there was more of a balance between the roles. I feel embarrassed that my kids are seeing me do all this stuff and that is going to temper their expectations of their partners at some point. I hope that I can talk to them enough to be prepared to be a good teammate to their chosen partner and that my son can pick up the slack where needed, and my daughter can set expectations that allow her to relieve herself of some of these responsibilities.

@Mrs. Cereal: your last line totally hits home to me!! I too hope to instill something different for my daughter...and after reading your comment I realized that my dad (who was a wonderful dad) was somewhat similar to my DH... LOL.. a very hard worker (my dad was a farmer) so he'd work very hard and then crash (nap, sleep during the day) bc he was so tired leaving most stuff to my mom. DH is very similar.. he works very LONG hours at his job and it's one thing that drew me to him in the first place, his drive.. however his drive has landed him in a job where he works LONGGG hours and just this weekend while we were home he was dozing off in his recliner... um as soon as I read your line the image of my dad and DH flashed through my mind......